Ray Arata is the author of two books, Wake Up Man Up, Step Up: Transforming Your Wake Up Call to Emotional Health and Happiness and Showing Up: How Men Can Become Effective Allies in the Workplace.

As an expert in leadership, inclusion, allyship, and emotional literacy, Ray leads from his heart and practices what he teaches in his own businesses and personal life.

In this interview, he describes what first made him interested in the field of men and masculinity. Thom & Ray then go on to the term 'toxic' and explore how unhelpful it is in terms of masculinity; 'unhealthy' is a much better description which doesn't close everyone down. They discuss how important is it not to shame and blame men in order to get them to engage. There is enormous pain in so many men and shaming has only negative consequences. On the other hand gender equality will make men better and happier.

Ray connects through the heart, and speaks about what love means to him.Finally they discuss allyship and the fundamental importance of accountability.

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