0:03

I'm Jonathan Walton and this is Queen

0:06

of the con The Unreal

0:08

Housewife episode eight,

0:11

a bonus episode. She's running

0:13

that joint. In this episode,

0:15

I talked to housewives connoisseur Kate

0:18

Casey, host of the podcast Reality

0:20

Life with Kate Casey, and veteran

0:22

Real Housewives producer Carlos King,

0:25

host of the Reality with the King

0:27

podcast. We fuss and discuss

0:30

all the craziness Genshaw is

0:32

up to now in prison and the fact

0:34

that she's not the only housewife

0:37

pretending to be wealthier than

0:39

she is. And Kate and Carlos

0:42

also give me their best predictions

0:44

on what happens to Genshaw after

0:47

prison. Enjoy. Carlos

0:50

King is our first time meeting. I'm so impressed with you.

0:52

You produced on Real Housewives

0:54

New Jersey and Atlanta.

0:58

Yes, that

1:02

is my protein shape because

1:05

I need to make sure that I

1:07

am fueled to do the job.

1:10

Yes, all right, What was it like producing

1:12

on Real Housewives New Jersey, Real Housewives Atlanta?

1:15

You know, producing both of those shows.

1:20

Looking back on it, it was very,

1:23

very very fun, but also

1:25

very challenging. But when you're a new

1:27

producer, you just are happy

1:29

you have a gig, and for me, The

1:32

Real Housewives of Atlanta was my first foray

1:34

into reality television. So I'm just

1:36

happy to have a job in reality

1:38

TV. And then my first

1:41

time on set, the producer

1:43

said to me, you're going to be assigned

1:46

to Nini Leaks and

1:48

the rest is history in terms of our relationship

1:52

and our friendship. Jersey was

1:54

the same thing. They said, You're assigned Teresa judaizing

1:57

Danielle style. I'm like, okay, so,

2:00

but it goes to show you that I was the

2:03

person who had to handle

2:06

strong, opinionated

2:08

women and it

2:10

allowed me to stretch my muscle

2:13

in telling women's stories and

2:15

to have the career that I have today.

2:17

And what were the Real Housewives like

2:20

in your experience? How real were they?

2:23

Oh?

2:23

Very real? You have to think about it.

2:24

The Real Housewives of Atlanta debuted

2:28

in October of two thousand and eight.

2:32

At that time, the only big reality

2:34

shows were The Hills and Laguna Beach,

2:36

which a lot of people at

2:38

the time even now would say it was

2:40

soft scripting.

2:42

Is this show real?

2:44

The Real Housewives brand from the inception

2:47

has always been to follow the reality and

2:49

to showcase these.

2:50

Women in their real form. These

2:53

women did not have any.

2:54

Sort of.

2:56

Person to idalyze to say I want to

2:58

be that person. They truly were being authentic.

3:01

So what you saw was women

3:04

who were truly being themselves. Teresa,

3:07

I fig you can see thirteen years later Teresa

3:09

still Teresa, and Niemi

3:12

is still MEMI very big, very bold,

3:14

very loud, very opinionated. So

3:17

it was the greatest example

3:19

of how reality show works in the sense

3:22

of you always have to cast

3:24

women who are able to go through their personal story,

3:26

and these women went there and.

3:28

I'll ask each of you this, what's

3:30

your take on overall

3:33

on jen Shaw.

3:34

Jenshaw to me personified

3:39

a savvy viewer who studied

3:43

every frame of Real Housewives

3:45

and plotted an opportunity for them

3:48

to become a housewife. I think the minute

3:50

someone got word that

3:52

the Real Housewives was looking

3:55

at Salt Lake City or her antennas went up

3:57

and she was like, I'm bringing my a game.

4:00

I think she's like the perfect

4:02

housewife in terms of somebody

4:04

who really believes, well, where have the cameras

4:07

been my whole life? Like, of course you're going to fill me. Even

4:09

though they're not a celebrity. They may not

4:12

have built like an incredible business. There's not

4:14

something that's spectacular in

4:16

terms of their life success or

4:18

career success. They still believe.

4:21

Well, of course cameras would follow me, I'm such

4:23

an incredible person. She kind

4:25

of is that personality for me.

4:27

So when you started to

4:29

watch her on camera, you thought, I

4:31

think she's overdoing it. And sometimes

4:34

when you watch it like a movie, you think

4:36

someone's overacting. She was

4:38

almost overdoing it in terms

4:40

of a reality star. The first

4:42

time I knew she was completely bombastic

4:45

was when I realized she was living in a rental

4:47

home and she had nailed shelving

4:50

units into the wall. I thought, you're

4:52

a monster who rents a house

4:55

and nails shelving into the

4:57

walls, somebody who believes they don't

5:00

need to live by other people's rules.

5:02

And was that publicized that she

5:04

was renting, because I thought she was trying

5:06

to portray as if she owns the place.

5:08

Actually, during the first season, it

5:11

was a real housewife of Dallas

5:13

on their podcast that noted,

5:16

well, I have a friend who owns

5:18

the house that Genshaw is renting right

5:21

outside of Salt Lake City. And

5:23

then everybody it spread like wildfire.

5:25

And once that happens in the Real Housewives

5:27

ecosystem. Then the vultures

5:30

come out and they will pick apart every detail

5:32

of your life. And if you are presenting

5:34

yourself as someone who's wealthy and you are

5:36

not, God bless you because

5:41

people don't take that to that lightly.

5:43

Carlos, your take on Genshaw, I

5:46

agree with everything Kate just said.

5:48

I will say this, She's fascinating, She's

5:50

a star. Kate's right. There's a

5:53

handful of women who were

5:55

born to be on television, and Genshaw

5:57

was born to be on TV. Not

6:00

necessarily prison in my mind at the time,

6:02

but she was born to be on television. She

6:05

is an attractive woman with the big

6:07

personality. She

6:10

has the type of bravado and

6:13

arrogance that makes a great housewife.

6:16

But she also had this

6:19

sort of lifestyle that

6:21

you thought was real at the time. And I

6:23

think Jenshaw represents the new age

6:26

of reality stars. Because Jonathan, you asked

6:28

me earlier, how was Nini

6:30

and Teresa where they rail in two thousand

6:32

and eight. Yes, But in twenty

6:35

twenty beyond, the newer

6:37

housewife started to become

6:40

a caricature of the icons

6:43

Jenshaw wanted to be the Teresa

6:45

Judais of Salt Lake

6:47

City, and we did not know

6:49

she would go that far as to being somebody

6:52

who also was going to go to a

6:54

timeout or camp, as Teresa calls

6:56

it.

6:57

So we didn't know to that degree she was,

6:59

you.

6:59

Know, mocking her idol, but

7:03

Jenshaw had to fake

7:05

it in order to make it dot

7:07

dot dot on a housewives show.

7:10

Yeah, that's so interesting because in a

7:12

sense, you know, while

7:14

she's running these telemarketing scams,

7:16

she's simultaneously in a

7:18

way scamming Bravo because she was

7:20

not anything she appeared

7:22

to be. She didn't own the house, she leased the cars,

7:25

the Fendi's, the Louis Vton's. Fake fake,

7:27

fake, like she was a fake real

7:29

housewife pretending to be really

7:31

wealthy. Not to say that she wasn't wealthy,

7:34

but she certainly wasn't as wealthy as she

7:36

portrayed, otherwise she would own

7:38

the homes. But our legal analyst

7:40

who we interviewed throughout the podcast, the amazing

7:42

Emily D. Baker, said it's by design

7:45

almost that she doesn't own a home or own anything

7:47

because she knows they're coming for her one day,

7:50

and she knows if you own a home. You're

7:52

saving a ton of money. Within the United States, they're

7:55

gonna take that. The Feds are gonna take that and

7:57

give it to the victims as restitution. So

7:59

we fear maybe she has all this stuff

8:01

offshore in Kosovo somewhere

8:04

because she doesn't own much.

8:06

I have to say, I think you're incorrect

8:09

in saying that that she

8:11

was swindling the network

8:13

making them believe she's wealthy. That's

8:16

what makes her a great star, is

8:18

that they know she's not wealthy, but she's presenting

8:21

herself. That makes an interesting

8:23

character. If you go to a dinner party and

8:25

you see someone dripping in luxury,

8:27

and then you start talking to them and you find

8:30

out that they work in telemarketing,

8:32

you start to go, well, that doesn't really add up. That

8:34

makes someone fascinating because the longer

8:37

they're on television, the more the layers

8:39

get peeled back of the onion, and that makes a

8:41

great story. So it's not

8:43

actually true that the network is

8:46

somehow scammed by all of these women.

8:48

They know exactly who they are and that is why

8:51

they are chosen to be on the show.

8:52

They wanted it.

8:54

Let's be very clear, Jennis Shaw is not the only

8:56

housewife who is faking it today. If

8:59

I had to do a I

9:01

would say more than fifty percent of

9:03

current housewives are leasing cars.

9:05

It's the name of the game. Because I

9:08

create shows. I produce shows. Right

9:12

when it comes to the Real Housewives brand, it's

9:15

affluent. It's a certain

9:18

lifestyle. You can't live

9:21

in a middle class

9:23

neighborhood right, drive

9:25

a Nissan Ultima,

9:28

be a school teacher

9:32

who takes out the trash themselves

9:34

every Thursday morning and

9:37

become a housewives.

9:38

You just can't. You just can't.

9:40

You could be on Naja de Fiance,

9:43

you can be married at first

9:45

sight, but you cannot be a real

9:47

housewife. A real housewive has a

9:49

certain order of

9:52

affluence that you need. And these women

9:55

who are dying or

9:57

attention and relevance and fame,

10:00

they will become broke at

10:03

bankrupt in order to have

10:05

fifteen men as a bank.

10:09

I had no idea because so before

10:11

this season of Queen of the Khan on Jenshaw,

10:13

I've never watched an episode of Housewives

10:17

only because I'm a reality producer

10:19

and all the shows I work on a couple similar

10:22

types of shows, and they were very heavily staged

10:24

and we do multiple takes and

10:26

we'd be like, hey, next time, when you shout at

10:28

her, look that way. You know, Take two, take

10:30

three. So I always thought

10:32

as a Real Housewives was one of those, but you're telling

10:35

me it's more real than that.

10:36

The beauty of housewives is that you

10:39

take women who perceive themselves

10:42

as very glamorous, royalty

10:44

adjacent and you put them in a room together.

10:47

You don't actually have to do that much

10:49

because all of them have such big personalities

10:52

and they're so complicated that the intersection

10:55

of those women creates the

10:57

most interesting conversations. That's

11:00

why Real Housewives is so beloved

11:04

by reality TV viewers, because

11:06

it's a window into a world that not

11:09

many people know, a world of affluence,

11:11

and whether it's real or it's

11:14

faked, it's a window into a world

11:16

that very few people get access to.

11:18

And from what the both of you were telling me, which

11:21

is news to me, the

11:23

majority of these women. It kind of attracts

11:26

scammers to a certain well.

11:27

But it's also affluent areas

11:30

bring con artists. It's a perfect

11:33

stage to set for con

11:35

artists because everyone

11:37

seems to be wealthy. It's like it's

11:40

a level playing field. And no one really

11:42

asks in depth questions. It's a very surface

11:44

level place. So no

11:47

one's asking you, well, where did you go to school?

11:49

And what was your first job? And did that company

11:52

go public? And who are the directors of those

11:54

companies? It's questions

11:56

like do you have a boat? Do you? Are you a

11:58

member of the Bay Club. So no

12:00

one actually asks anything, so

12:03

very rarely will people's bullshit

12:05

story be unraveled.

12:06

It's sort of like imagine Birding Madoff's

12:09

wife. Do you know what I mean?

12:10

On paper, a quintessential

12:13

housewife, archetype married

12:15

to this affluent man, super

12:18

rich, super wealthy, has a boat, has a

12:20

private plane. If that

12:22

person on paper came across

12:24

your desk and you were casting

12:26

them, she would be cast just

12:28

based on what's happening on paper. But

12:31

to Kate's point, you don't dig deep in

12:33

terms of asking the preblic questions as

12:35

if you were part of the FBI. But look,

12:37

that's not our job. You know, that's

12:40

not our job. And that's the reason why you

12:42

can't blame networks production companies

12:45

producers, because we're

12:47

not asking you to show true

12:50

proofs of income of W two income

12:52

text that dates back to two years

12:55

in order to be on the show, because for

12:57

us, it's all about do you fit the Quintin

13:00

Central standard for this particular program,

13:03

and if you have what it takes to showcase

13:06

that on a zoom call Ben

13:08

Honey, you.

13:09

Have a job.

13:10

But I also think people, it's

13:13

just the way it's human, the

13:15

way the humans operate. Rich

13:18

people attract friends. So

13:20

if you're a horrible person but you have a

13:22

lot of things, people want to be your

13:24

friend. Now, if you live in a shack

13:27

and you have a degree, and you're interesting

13:29

and you like to talk about political theory, probably

13:32

don't have many friends in an affluent area. But

13:35

if you're horrible and you have like

13:37

a Lamborghini and you have a house

13:39

in Hawaii and you give parties

13:42

where you have a to go bag, you're

13:45

gonna have a lot of friends.

13:47

That is that is very true.

13:48

Well put on during the entire

13:50

criminal proceeding against Jenshaw, she

13:54

was, you know, proclaiming her innocence

13:57

to no end. How did you

13:59

both handle that? Did

14:01

either of you at any point think she was actually

14:04

in acent? Did you think she was guilty the whole time?

14:06

What was your process?

14:09

I always thought

14:12

she was guilty. What

14:14

I have learned is when the FEDS

14:16

do that sort of deep dive of

14:18

an investigation and they finally say,

14:21

okay, you're about to become arrested, it's because

14:23

it took them years in order to come

14:25

to that conclusion and it's hard to get out of. Like,

14:27

they're not going to run

14:29

the risk of saying we got

14:31

it wrong here. That's what I was told. I'm not a

14:33

lawyer, I don't pretend to be one. Don't cast

14:36

me at all. So

14:38

that's why I thought, like, Okay, it

14:40

has to be true that she's guilty

14:42

of this, but I will take it a step further.

14:45

The one thing that annoyed me and

14:47

made me as a black person is

14:50

when she tried to make it about race,

14:53

and she said, you know, and

14:55

I took personal offense to that, because

14:58

we do know that there's this there's

15:00

this situation going on between law enforcement

15:03

and people of color.

15:04

It's real, it's true, it's been

15:06

going on for years.

15:08

Don't take something that is actually affecting

15:10

this culture and

15:13

apply it to your situation and

15:15

to make it seem like they got it wrong and

15:17

you're being targeted because

15:20

you're a woman of color. That

15:22

alone bothered me because it's

15:25

sort of like, just admit

15:27

to it or guess what. If you want to say

15:30

you're innocent, that's fine, but please

15:32

don't make it about race, because there are people

15:34

of color who are dealing with stuff where

15:36

we are accuses of christ we did not commit.

15:38

So that part bothered me. I

15:40

mean that bothered me too, And I'm glad you brought that up.

15:42

It was it, you know, and we profiled

15:44

it throughout the podcast several times publicly

15:47

she would say it's because I'm a woman

15:49

of color.

15:50

I'm being falsely prosecuted.

15:51

They were attacking me because I'm a woman of color, and

15:54

it made me sick because I knew

15:56

that's not true.

15:57

And you bring up a brilliant point.

16:00

One hundred percent of federal prosecutions

16:02

end with a conviction, so you are correct.

16:05

By the time the Feds arrest you,

16:07

you are guilty. They know it, they can prove

16:09

it. They're confident. So that's

16:12

interesting. You thought she was guilty from the get Kate

16:14

Casey, what about you?

16:16

I thought she was guilty too. I thought it was

16:18

absurd the way that she would berate

16:21

other people for asking any question

16:23

that's usually like a red flag someone's

16:25

done something. Yes, I

16:29

thought that, in particular

16:31

the way that she would manipulate the friendship of

16:33

Heather Gay. Heather clearly

16:36

is someone who grew up in a Mormon church. She

16:39

felt abandoned by her church and

16:41

therefore perhaps hangs

16:43

on to friends longer than she should. And

16:46

I felt like Jen

16:48

weaponized that. And I hate

16:51

seeing relationships like that. So I

16:53

don't like what she did to the people in her life who

16:55

dared to ask questions.

16:58

I mean, and that is a narcissist through

17:00

and through. When you ask them something, they're

17:02

offended and turn it back on you.

17:04

How dare you? Yeah?

17:07

Wow?

17:08

For Do you think Genshaw

17:11

is sorry, actually sorry for

17:13

what she did?

17:14

Or you think she's just sorry she

17:16

got caught.

17:17

I'll tell you what quote recently

17:19

attributed to her quote,

17:21

I'm committed to doing the work necessary to make

17:23

my victims whole and prove worthy

17:26

of a second chance. I've learned to focus

17:28

and what I can and cannot control. Do

17:30

you think she's actually sorry?

17:32

No, I

17:34

think she's sorry that she's missing

17:37

time away from her kids. I

17:39

think she's sorry about that. I think she's sorry

17:41

she's missing time away from the television show. But

17:44

I think someone like Jenshaw spends

17:46

an enormous amount of time every day plotting

17:49

what am I going to do when I'm out of here?

17:52

What can I pitch to my agent? What networks

17:54

are going to be interested the way she

17:56

even posted on her Instagram a story about

17:59

the woman that she came to Joe with Kashara,

18:01

It's all part of this ongoing

18:04

story of like angst and

18:06

pain, and there's a total disregard

18:09

for the elderly victims that

18:11

lost their fortunes, people who

18:14

have had health problems as the result of stress

18:16

from losing all of their money. When

18:18

there's a total disregard for the people that

18:20

you've affected and it's all about you.

18:22

No, I don't think she cares at all.

18:25

Can you read that? Do you have that quote up nearby

18:28

that Instagram? Yeah? Read

18:30

it. It's important to say.

18:32

It's a carousel, so they're actually

18:34

like six slides on it. But she says journal

18:37

entry number two. Kashanna, whose

18:39

nickname is Special K, also

18:41

surrendered with me yesterday and this

18:43

is from March tenth. We've kind of

18:45

stuck together the first full day as we both

18:47

walked and shocked stunned and scared,

18:50

trying to figure out where we go from here. I

18:52

would also just like decide. Note I don't think she wrote

18:54

this. Today is Saturday. There

18:57

is a six am brown bag breakfast

18:59

brought into the common area of our unit. I

19:01

was so tired and didn't wake up, but special

19:03

K got one for me. She is kind,

19:06

and there are not many kind people in this place.

19:08

It had one piece of wheat bread and apple,

19:11

two packets of jelly, and a packet of instant

19:13

oatmeal. I ate the piece of bread.

19:16

A lady was offering instant coffee in the common

19:18

area, but I didn't have a mug. I saved

19:20

the apple an oatmeal packet in my locker since

19:22

I don't go to the commissary until next Tuesday.

19:25

If I get hungry, I can at least have something

19:27

to eat. First of all,

19:30

somebody on her staff that she

19:33

still employs with whatever five cents

19:35

she has in her bank account,

19:37

went on Canva to recreate a

19:39

carousel based on entries

19:42

that she emailed or gave to

19:44

coach, you know, at a visit. And

19:46

she's like continuing

19:49

this narrative like that she's a victim. I

19:51

don't give a shit. If you have one piece of wheat

19:53

bread, how about the people have four skittles

19:56

in their bank accounts.

19:57

Because you screwed them over.

19:59

She relentless in

20:01

the pursuit of making herself a

20:03

victim and a martyr, and it's unbelievably

20:06

whack job. But you know that's the reason

20:08

she was cast because she is melodramatic,

20:11

she is bombastic, she is

20:14

delusional, and she is

20:18

manipulative. And I think even

20:21

in prison, she's still trying

20:23

to manipulate anyone who's willing to.

20:25

Listen, Carlos

20:29

your tank.

20:29

Is she sorry, no,

20:32

listen, I don't think so.

20:33

Because the thing is this, you have to have

20:35

a sense of humility when you are

20:38

accused of a crime that you did commit. So

20:41

when you first start off your statement saying

20:44

I'm innocent, I'm being targeted

20:46

racial profiling, that

20:49

doesn't sound like a woman who's STARp at

20:51

what she did, knowing she did it.

20:52

Then when she.

20:53

Played guilty, she apologized

20:55

to the victims and said

20:58

I knew what I was doing. I was blah

21:00

blah blah blah blah. If

21:02

she would have started off that statement when

21:05

she first got accused of it, then

21:07

I would have believed like, Okay, you

21:10

feel sorry for what you did, but

21:12

I think you have to know the type of personality

21:15

she is, and listen, I'm not judging.

21:16

Her, because that's not my job.

21:19

I take her at face value in the sense

21:21

of who I see on the show

21:23

and who I see interviews, and whose behavior

21:27

I witness, and I'm like, I

21:29

don't think there's anything about her based

21:32

on what I've seen that reeks

21:35

of a woman who's sorry for anything she's done

21:37

outside of the crime. I think the

21:39

way she behaves is because

21:41

she believes that

21:44

she is the best thing that happened to Salt Lake

21:46

City, and she

21:49

just has that arrogant personality.

21:52

I remember I was interviewing one of the housewives

21:54

and the housewife kept saying,

21:57

I'm so sorry I keep getting a FaceTime from

21:59

Jenshaw. I said, well, like,

22:02

tell her you're in an interview, and

22:04

I was witnessed to how captivated

22:06

they all are to her. I

22:08

don't know, Maybe I should

22:10

text her back like you're in the middle of an

22:13

interview, are you kidding me? Later, I

22:15

had a conversation with that same housewife and

22:17

I said, how can you be supportive

22:20

of someone that does this?

22:22

And has obviously lied.

22:25

And their response was, but she's

22:27

so fun.

22:30

I mean that hits it on the head. The power

22:33

and the magic of every con artists. They're charismatic,

22:36

they suck you in, they get you like them, they

22:38

get you to love them, and that's the

22:40

coercional control they exert. Even

22:42

in the face of accusations and

22:45

evidence.

22:46

People support her. Still she's

22:48

in jail and people support her.

22:50

But I find so fascinating. I think

22:52

you and I had this conversation Kate how

22:56

Erica Jane, for example, who

22:59

wasn't directly accused

23:01

of stealing from the orphans

23:04

and doing all the things that her husband

23:06

Tom Giraldi was allegedly accused of. Right,

23:08

she had no direct line into

23:11

handling those alleged

23:14

accusations. Right, she was guilty

23:17

by proxy by being this man's

23:20

wife who benefited from

23:22

it by courtesy of private jets

23:24

and Glam Squad and fifty

23:26

thousand dollars Glam Squad Davies.

23:31

But people said she's.

23:32

Not likable, and they railroaded

23:34

her and read her for film. When it came

23:37

to Jenshaw, who actually

23:40

did the crime, like actually

23:42

physically did it, people

23:46

worshiped her and I thought that was

23:48

very strange because on one hand, you have

23:50

Erica Jane, who did

23:52

not have her hands in it, so

23:54

to speak, but Jenshaw did.

23:56

But because Erica Jane is so stoic, who

24:00

who really comes across like I am

24:02

who I am, people dismissed

24:04

her.

24:05

But for Genshaw, because.

24:06

She's witty and she's fine and

24:09

she's whims the call, it's like

24:11

they gave her a pass. And I thought that was fascinating

24:13

in terms of how the audience

24:16

judges people based on their personality

24:19

trade.

24:20

I also think there's a micro judgment

24:23

too, because one is from

24:25

Beverly Hills, where it's

24:27

so out of people's realm

24:31

of understanding their wealth, versus

24:33

Salt Lake City, which I think in the

24:36

there's this mindset that it's a more down

24:38

to earth place like Jenshaw's

24:41

wealth seems far more relatable

24:43

to someone like Erica Jane.

24:46

So that's a part of it too. Another

24:48

nuance to it, it's not relatable

24:51

for most people to consider

24:54

the highest paid plaintiff attorney

24:56

who had multi million dollar settlements

24:59

and his pop star

25:02

adjacent wife dripping in Cardier

25:05

versus jen Shaw, who presented

25:08

herself as almost like a stay

25:10

at home mom and at a side business and

25:13

a football coach husband. So

25:16

of course the audience is going

25:18

to feel more connected to Jen and

25:20

her husband. That's far more relatable

25:23

and more Americana than

25:25

the plaintive attorney.

25:28

Very true.

25:28

I hadn't thought of it that way, but yeah,

25:34

so yeah, I'll ask again, what's

25:36

Jen Shaw up to in federal prison?

25:40

She's running that joints

25:43

like this story of like there was one weak

25:45

piece of bread in the bag. I don't believe

25:47

that for one minute. I think she is

25:49

running some scam there where people

25:52

are giving her money. She's probably got a bunch

25:54

of snacks in the pod. I think

25:57

she she did some statement where she

25:59

said she's other women ESL.

26:03

I was like, wait what. I just

26:05

can't imagine her sitting and taking the time

26:07

to listen to someone's personal story and to help

26:10

them read. I think she's just running the whole

26:12

place. She's running plays left and

26:14

right.

26:14

What do you think, Carlos, I'm

26:17

sorry,

26:20

I think Katy's hilarious. I was

26:22

actually envisioning what you were saying as you were talking

26:24

about it. I actually listen.

26:27

I agree with you in the sense I

26:29

think she's running the joy. I think she's

26:32

Big mo from the movie Chicago, Queen

26:34

my Teeth's character.

26:35

I think I think

26:37

she is like, I'm Big Mama,

26:40

and what I say goes yes.

26:44

I think she's pipping out the women.

26:46

I think she definitely has so

26:48

much money in her books courtesy of

26:51

other people's family members donations.

26:54

I think jen Shaw, listen

26:56

the type of personality trait

26:59

she has, she

27:01

doesn't come across as a woman who

27:04

is going to drown her sorrows.

27:07

I think she's going to make the best out

27:09

of her situation the best

27:11

way she knows how, and

27:13

that's by running the joint.

27:15

I think she's a ruler. I

27:17

think she has found

27:19

her team. I think she

27:22

has found in the worst of the strip club.

27:24

Don't ask me how I know this, but I think

27:26

she's found her her bottom

27:28

bitch.

27:29

That's the woman, right

27:31

Kate.

27:32

She's found her bottom bitch, which is the woman

27:34

who's like her right hand person. I

27:37

think she's, like Kate

27:40

said, I think she is the

27:43

star of that prison.

27:45

The minute she leaves, she's on the phone

27:47

with her agent on standby

27:49

and she's like, I've got an idea for a script.

27:52

I have an idea for this, We're going

27:54

to do merch. She is plotting

27:56

the entire time she's in there. Now, she

27:58

was sentenced and she's to serve six and a

28:01

half. Here's I'm sure that will

28:03

be reduced. I'm gonna say she walks out after four.

28:05

From what I've read Jenshaw, she's

28:09

keeping a diary and selling subscriptions

28:11

for her diary in prison. She's

28:14

creating a real Housewives of

28:16

Brian prison play with

28:19

other inmates.

28:20

She claims to be tutoring them.

28:22

She recently completed an anger management

28:25

course and reportedly said she

28:27

wished she had this when she did The Housewives.

28:30

Let's put it this way, I would not be surprised

28:32

if she made an appearance on Love After Lockup,

28:35

Like someone she's in a pod with is dating

28:37

somebody from Idaho, and

28:40

she weasels her way into the plot line,

28:42

and we see her next season on Love After

28:44

Lockup my friend Jen here and they're

28:46

like, She's like, everyone's amazing.

28:49

I mean, I wouldn't put a papist. If

28:53

Josh Mangowitz and Keith Morrison

28:55

show up too the Brian jail to interview

28:58

someone, she will figure out a way be

29:00

in it. It'll be an interview with somebody who murdered

29:02

their husband, and she'll

29:04

somehow find her way an opportunity

29:06

to also be interviewed.

29:09

I'm sure.

29:10

Just a few days ago, it appears

29:13

she posted on threads that's it.

29:15

Yeah, and the post was

29:17

I hope everyone's shaw amazing. I mean clearly

29:19

that was one of her pr people, because I

29:22

don't think you can post from threads in prison. What's

29:24

the strategy there, like to keep in the public

29:26

consciousness and you can.

29:28

To keep people talking. She's making

29:30

calls, she's emailing,

29:32

she takes every opportunity. She's like, keep my name

29:35

in people's mouths. But you know what, that's

29:37

Real Housewives strategy one on one. Listen,

29:40

you can take the girl off of Real Housewives,

29:43

but the girl never leaves Real Housewives.

29:45

No, when Jenshaw

29:48

gets out of prison in five or six years, do

29:50

you think Bravo will have her back. I'll

29:52

preface this with a quote from Andy Cohen, who

29:55

was very supportive of Jen before

29:57

she pled guilty, and then was shocked

30:00

when Jen pled guilty, and he said,

30:03

I'm upset, and I'm especially upset

30:05

for her victims.

30:06

I'm upset that she was accused.

30:07

If you remember sitting there in the reunion show,

30:09

she was so dogmatic about it, I felt,

30:12

Okay.

30:12

Let this woman have her day in court.

30:14

I'm extremely upset about what she said,

30:16

because, frankly, you get to know someone, you get

30:18

to like them, you get to have a personal relationship,

30:20

and you work with someone and you want to cheer them

30:22

on, and you hate to think that they're capable of this behavior.

30:25

Andy Cullen is pissed

30:28

that she's guilty.

30:29

I think he's hot and pissed for a hot minute

30:31

because he thought that they were going to do an interview

30:33

and then she pulled

30:36

out which anybody who does the show can understand.

30:39

In my opinion, she

30:41

serves her time. It says that she has

30:43

had a forfeit six point five million dollars,

30:46

thirty luxury items, seventy eight

30:48

counterfeit items. If she

30:50

serves time and she does all those things,

30:53

who cares if she goes back. She

30:56

served her.

30:56

Time, and you can it for her.

30:58

I mean, if she's interesting

31:01

enough. I mean I would assume that's a storyline

31:03

you want to chase, Like, how do Heather and Meredith

31:05

cope when she returns?

31:08

What is her life like? Does she still

31:10

have relationships with her kids? What

31:12

about her family members, because they certainly

31:14

supported her too, and I think they got swindled.

31:17

I mean, I think,

31:19

of course they're going to follow that storyline.

31:21

Will people embrace her the same way?

31:24

I don't know. Unfortunately, in the world we live

31:26

in, if you're funny and you look like

31:28

you have Carrie a nice bag, they might

31:31

No.

31:31

I do agree, I think Listen, I

31:34

do think she'll be asked back.

31:35

I think I think in.

31:37

Terms of a pr move, they may say, come

31:39

back as a friend and earn your housewife

31:41

title. I want thousand percent thinks she'll

31:43

come back. You want to follow the story.

31:45

I'm being very honest. I'm going to watch

31:48

to see how she is. Am I going to

31:50

watch the entire season? I don't know, But am

31:52

I curious enough to see

31:55

who she's become after present

31:57

apps of freaking Lately? I'm going

31:59

to watch to see that. And the

32:01

difference between her and Teresa is

32:04

at the end of the day, I think almost every

32:06

woman, especially almost

32:09

every housewife, understood that. Okay,

32:11

I can understand how Teresa were

32:14

signing her name on papers

32:16

that she wasn't aware what she was signing.

32:19

As a housewife and a woman's husband,

32:21

you do trust her husband, and I think there was

32:23

empathy for Teresa, because again it

32:26

wasn't No one believes Teresa knew what

32:28

was going on. I think a lot of people understand

32:30

that Teresa was bamboozled by

32:32

her husband, and like most women,

32:36

not all, but most, if the husband

32:38

puts the papers in front of you, hey, babe, there's

32:40

our income tax. Sign your name here, they're

32:43

gonna do it without questions asked. But that's

32:46

why Teresa was able to come back and the show became

32:48

bigger. They put the show on pause for Teresa.

32:51

I think Jenshaw would have to earn her housewife

32:53

title. But I do agree with Kay. I think

32:55

you haven't seen the end of Jenshaw. If

32:59

so, Lake City last the next four years.

33:02

But if it doesn't come back, there'll

33:04

be some other show. She will be on

33:06

reality television shows

33:08

for the rest of her life. If it's marriage

33:10

boot Camp, if it's the Food Network

33:13

SmackDown how to make a cast role, she

33:15

will find a way.

33:17

I assure you.

33:18

That with one wheat bread, Kay,

33:20

how to make a casts all with one wheak

33:22

bread, Yes, that will.

33:23

Be the SmackDown on the Food Network what to do

33:25

with one piece of wheatbread, an apple,

33:28

and an instant oatmeal pack, and it will become

33:30

full circle.

33:31

She'll get that on T shirts.

33:33

That's going to be the shirt. She leaves the jail in one

33:36

piece of wheat bread and says that what's

33:38

the merch line right there?

33:41

Yep, sounds like something she'd do for sure,

33:43

and FYI already Jenshaw's

33:46

six and a half year federal prison sentence

33:48

has been reduced by an entire year.

33:51

She's now scheduled to be released August

33:54

thirtieth, twenty twenty eight. Thank

33:56

you for listening to this season The Queen of the Con.

33:58

If you're new to the podcast, we have three

34:00

previous seasons about three

34:03

distinctly different con queens you can

34:05

venge. Season one, The Irish

34:07

Heriss, chronicles how con artist

34:10

Mayor Smith tricked her way into my

34:12

life and scammed me out of close to

34:14

one hundred thousand dollars using

34:16

a series of unbelievable

34:18

confidence tricks that literally

34:20

brought me to my knees. In

34:23

season two, The OC Savior, we

34:25

meet con artist Lizzie Mulder, who

34:27

impersonates a cast of made up

34:29

characters using voice changing

34:32

apps on her phone to scam

34:34

her close circle of friends and clients out

34:37

of more than a million dollars. And

34:39

season three, The Rich Girl is

34:42

all about con artist Danielle

34:44

Miller. Part time social media

34:46

influencer, full time scammer.

34:49

Danielle figures out a way to basically

34:51

impersonate anyone in the flesh,

34:54

walk into their bank and withdraw

34:57

all their money, no questions

34:59

asked. I sincerely believe

35:02

the more you know about how con

35:04

artists operate, the less likely

35:06

you are to become a victim. So pay attention

35:09

and stay.

35:09

Safe out there.

35:11

If you're enjoying Queen of the Con, click

35:13

that share button and send it to your friends

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and family. Also, if you can

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really help other listeners find us. Queen

35:23

of the Con. The Unreal Housewife

35:25

is a production of AYR Media

35:28

and iHeartMedia, hosted by me Jonathan

35:30

Walton. Executive producers

35:33

Jonathan Walton for Jonathan Walton

35:35

Productions and Elisa Rosen for

35:37

AYR Media. Written by

35:40

Jonathan Walton, Segment producer

35:42

Gregory Harvey, Senior Associate

35:45

producer Jill Peshesnik, Coordinator

35:48

Melena Krolysky, edited

35:51

by Justin Longerbean audio

35:54

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35:56

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35:59

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36:01

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36:03

producer for iHeartMedia, Maya

36:06

Howard