0:07

Welcome, everybody, to the Advanced Selling Podcast, the

0:09

longest running sales training podcast in the history

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of podcasts. My name is Brian Neal. My

0:13

name is Bill Kasky. Here every

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Those were great. Yeah, send us an audio,

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how to get out of it. We'll

1:00

protect your anonymity too. Yeah. Unless

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you want to be famous and you say your first

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name and last name and then everyone will blow you

1:07

up on LinkedIn. Like I heard you on the Advanced

1:09

Selling Podcast. World

1:13

famous. All right. You

1:15

ready? I'm ready. I'm ready.

1:18

A little choppy today, huh?

1:21

Well, it's a Monday. It

1:24

is. My

1:28

granddaughter Sawyer, who's seven, has a YouTube

1:30

channel and we played, I think we

1:32

played something here a few months ago

1:34

around Christmas. She did a holiday thing

1:37

and it's funny. What's funny

1:39

about it is that we will come into

1:41

the studio here and she'll say, Papa, I

1:43

want to do a video. Okay, fine. Do

1:46

you know what it's about? No, it's kind

1:48

of like us on the Advanced Selling Podcast.

1:50

Just hit. And so I'll hit

1:52

record and she'll go, is it going? And

1:54

I said, yeah, she, and she just starts.

1:56

Hey guys, welcome to Sawyer YouTube channel. She

1:58

doesn't have any ideas. What you're going to

2:01

order as just like whatever the stream of

2:03

consciousness, whatever the Lord deserted talk about. She

2:05

talks about ancestors, but the other day she

2:07

was up. I don't you get

2:09

this thing about a food pantry. I think she

2:11

may be heard at church or something. She was

2:14

all inquisitive but a food pantry and my wife

2:16

says was are you can you can take thanks

2:18

to the food pantry but you have to make

2:20

sure a that they're in a can. And.

2:22

Be there are not expired. Typical

2:25

adage of yeah I like it So she

2:27

decided to shoot video. On

2:29

food pantries which I don't think she's ever set

2:32

foot in the one, but mail a big audience

2:34

for the Food Pantry Podcast which I just love

2:36

the The Suspects or Soy Years Here it is.

2:57

That. What?

3:27

He was you to is the idea

3:29

that oh about nine times during that

3:32

video can't be expires. it's gotta be

3:34

in a can. I was just see

3:36

was hammering that home and I are

3:38

those I feel that does. She has

3:41

a our future and as pets woman

3:43

a slight yeah it's ethically dial. One

3:45

hundred four Seven Flowers That's one. Eight

3:47

hundred four seven flowers. Don't roof. Don't

3:49

forget as inspired and gotta be. Yes,

3:52

get your credit card out and ethical

3:54

his number. Now I think I'm going

3:56

to give Sawyer. have an idea

3:58

your i think she should start swag store.

4:02

And one of her first t-shirts should say,

4:04

gotta be in a can. That's her brand.

4:09

That is fantastic. Gotta be in

4:12

a can. Can't be expired. That

4:15

is so cute. How fun is that? And then,

4:17

yeah, about the fifth time in, she even said

4:19

to the camera, I think I said this before,

4:21

but anyway, it can't be in a can't be

4:23

expired. It's gotta be like, you don't realize you

4:26

didn't, you didn't hear the last five times it

4:28

came out of your mouth. You know, it's important.

4:30

It is. Yeah. You don't want to be taking

4:32

in stuff with us. I

4:34

might, if you're comfortable with it, send me that

4:37

because I have a, I actually have a

4:39

client who sells to food pantries. I

4:42

do. Yeah. A long-term client that sells to food

4:44

pantries. I bet they would get a kick out

4:46

of that. They would. Yeah. Okay. Topic. We're going

4:49

to talk about motivation today. We're going to

4:52

talk about motivation and compensation and forecasting basically

4:54

for the theme of the month, along

4:57

with one of our newest partners, our

4:59

friends at exactly Corp exactly have

5:02

a really great platform. We we've met them

5:04

through another connection at a show and

5:06

they said, you know, we think we've got some good stuff

5:09

to share with your audience. We said, okay. And so they're

5:11

on board for a

5:13

little partnership with us and we're going

5:15

to, Bill and I are going to do two

5:17

episodes first. Just about

5:19

a little bit about motivation, what intrinsically motivates

5:21

salespeople, what doesn't. And then we're going to

5:23

talk about forecasting, forecasting your comp, your commissions,

5:25

that sort of stuff. That's really important for

5:27

people to do. And then we're going to

5:30

bring our friends on from exactly and talk

5:32

about their viewpoints. So today

5:34

we're going to start that process. By the

5:36

way, their website's exactly corp.com. If you want

5:38

to go check them out, exactly corp.com. And

5:42

they're going to give us, they're going to give you all as an

5:44

ASP listener later in the month, a

5:46

really cool little freebie. You got

5:48

to stick around. Listen to all

5:50

the episodes. But this first topic they talk about

5:52

and they're solving a great problem is this whole

5:55

idea of where commissions sit and

5:57

motivation for sales teams And

5:59

sales. Individuals and we want to talk

6:01

a little bit though my about our

6:03

viewpoints of some motivation commission how think

6:06

about it, how what we've seen people

6:08

do that works, what doesn't work and

6:10

as or think both for sales leaders

6:12

and for the sales at teams himself.

6:14

So. Humid

6:16

as start with a little sure. Statement.

6:20

Ah my first statement and we may

6:23

have said this past episodes by think

6:25

this is really important to to realize

6:27

is where does commission sit in your.

6:30

Arm Intrinsic Motivation Value. We.

6:33

Know from there for an assessment the

6:35

Bill and I've used in the past

6:37

that really only about half of the

6:39

humans. On. The Earth are motivated by

6:41

money. And

6:44

so most sales people are sales

6:46

leaders. When they're designing com plants,

6:49

think that everybody is. That.

6:51

I think that is the first fallacy

6:53

of the first myth is. But.

6:56

Thinking that if I toss a commission plan

6:58

on someone everyone is going to like jump

7:00

out of their chairs. Because. They

7:02

can make a bazillion our staff and

7:04

I just have not found that to

7:06

be completely true. There

7:08

are some obviously they're a half people are that

7:10

way, but some are not. so. What's. Your

7:13

take on that Would you? Yeah, my take

7:15

is at its it's always a mix. It's

7:17

always a. And. Even the Hogan,

7:19

which we talked about earlier

7:21

that that's a mix between

7:23

security what motivates you Security

7:25

predictability, Adventure of money in

7:27

L. Kali a

7:30

little cause. Social? Social. just. I think

7:32

it's always a mix and I think

7:34

the challenge is that when your

7:36

company. Comes. To you as

7:38

if that's the only motivator. Money.

7:41

yeah you have to you have to filter

7:43

that through and say okay i appreciate that

7:45

but but you need to know me and

7:48

you get into say this or if you're

7:50

not comfortable saying you have to say okay

7:52

i understand them company wants pay me on

7:54

on successor results but there's a lot of

7:56

other things that i'm that are important to

7:58

me and you have those in mind,

8:00

you can't expect them. To

8:03

be honest with you, I'm sorry to

8:05

say this, your company doesn't care. They

8:08

don't care what your other four motivators are. They

8:10

don't. All they're interested

8:12

in is you performing and

8:15

they will pay you for that. Part

8:17

of that payment is an incentive. So I think it's

8:20

a mix, but I think we've got to be hyper

8:22

aware and not feel shame if

8:24

money just doesn't get us out of bed in the

8:26

morning. Some mornings

8:28

it might and it's a fluid situation, I

8:31

think. That's

8:33

really good. Yeah. And that's

8:35

funny because I think it's almost

8:37

as if some employees think you should

8:39

read my mind and you should understand,

8:41

you should get me to a deep

8:43

level where like you said, Bill,

8:45

at the core, the company is there to sustain

8:47

itself, to make money for its owners and its

8:50

shareholders. And they

8:52

do that on the sales team through paying

8:55

an incentive compensation for performance. It's a performance

8:57

based deal. That's the deal. What

9:00

do you think about this? There's another thing I see.

9:02

So when companies, this

9:04

is a loaded, loaded subject,

9:06

compensation design. I

9:09

know exactly helps companies with this. It's

9:12

been my take that companies

9:16

tend to over-complicate compensation

9:18

plans. Absolutely. And when they

9:21

do, they erode trust. Absolutely.

9:23

Because salespeople will dive into

9:25

it and salespeople tend to

9:27

look at where they're getting

9:29

screwed on the

9:31

comp plan. And when it gets difficult to

9:33

compute, salespeople spend a lot of time on

9:35

their own, seeing if

9:37

they got paid. I've got a case

9:39

in point from this guy that's a

9:42

sales guy and he's in this

9:44

basically negotiation with his owner

9:48

over a compensation thing. And

9:50

I have another one that happened

9:52

last year Where

9:55

the comp plan's built. It's kind of complicated.

9:57

Company didn't cover everything. Guy sends this enormous

9:59

deal. And his commission per

10:01

their commission plan. Was. Like

10:03

as much as the President makes in

10:05

the company and I'll mike. Sorry.

10:08

Company? Yeah, you know, but they'll went away we

10:10

can for you that much I'm like whoa, What?

10:12

Nothing amiss? A switch? Your take on that though,

10:14

I guess, right? Complication? Yeah,

10:16

I mean I can't I can't tell

10:18

you how a times when I asked

10:20

for sales even a sales manager? What?

10:22

What's the cop plants they just go

10:25

to Snickers was he says well. Are

10:27

you sitting down the have a. D. Have

10:29

a a chart to have one as

10:31

big drafting tables one old school yeah

10:33

cause I'm gonna tell you and it's

10:35

gonna take seven hours to walk you

10:37

through it. Yeah, I agree. I mean,

10:39

I understand why there's gates and why you know at

10:42

some point maybe a hit one hundred percent court and

10:44

then the numbers go up. I like something that's easy

10:46

to understand, so I oughta. I don't have to spend

10:48

a lot of time trying to figure how to beat

10:50

the system. I.

10:53

Just don't you know the certain profitability on

10:55

certain items that I understand that you know

10:57

we get a brand new product. We're going

10:59

to pay an extra commission today for the

11:01

first five hundred thousand dollars. but if he

11:04

gets over five hundred thousand gonna gonna two

11:06

percent, can you find a way them to

11:08

simplify it. The. Least sales and

11:10

sales years. And. Now

11:12

here it's I do think in this. I.

11:14

Don't know if you want to go

11:17

down this path. Ice: I think short

11:19

term incentives are good to were me.

11:21

Maybe maybe this introduction of a new

11:23

product is not tied to your a

11:25

global compensation plan your annual but it's

11:27

a ninety day pusher. A ninety day

11:29

Blitz Owner: You know we're going to

11:32

introduce this product. Of And we're

11:34

going to give you some tools. So it's

11:36

not just you update, We're going to give you

11:38

some tools. Really give you some videos. Were going

11:40

to walk you through. gonna help you. It's

11:42

but it's a team saying but there's competition between

11:45

the team. Other competition is very healthy. but

11:48

i think it's when it's that's all there

11:50

is then he starts to have people sniping

11:52

at each other and and not passing leads

11:54

back and forth and cannabis sabotaging and as

11:56

not good but i think short term set

11:58

us are good I think

12:00

Sawyer was on to something. You

12:03

know, it's that simple. It's got to be

12:05

in a can. It can't be expired. Your

12:07

compensation plan should be as simple as Sawyer's

12:10

declaration of what food pantries

12:12

will take. Got to be

12:14

in a can. It can't be expired. If

12:16

your comp plan doesn't pass that test, a

12:18

sniff test of two, then that a

12:22

seven-year-old, right? It's true though, isn't it? It

12:25

should be able to be understood because here's the

12:27

other thing that gets in the way then. When

12:29

it's complicated again, if it's

12:32

complicated for a salesperson who's

12:34

a professional business person with usually, you

12:36

know, a degree or an advanced degree

12:38

and some smarts there, then

12:40

it's going to be complicated for the person figuring it

12:43

out. And then now we're into this. Well, no, this

12:45

you've got to pay me this on that and that

12:47

on this and then you can't predict. And I

12:50

know some of my clients expect because

12:52

they run the Commission through their filter and they're

12:54

thinking they're going to get 8,000, but

12:57

they get their Commission checking at 6,200. Now

13:00

we're in this big angsty thing and what a

13:02

waste of time. It's a waste of time. It's

13:04

actually a waste of time. And

13:06

you're right. It starts to,

13:09

you know, just create trust

13:11

issues. It's like, okay,

13:13

I'm given all I can and again, I'm taking

13:15

the individuals path

13:19

here, but I also know there's the

13:21

company side too. So there's two sides,

13:23

but man, if you're

13:25

in a place of leadership, and your people

13:27

are spending too much time with our calculator

13:29

on the on the comp plan, it's not

13:31

right. It's just not right. And

13:34

and we also can't forget about

13:36

the customer in all of this. You know,

13:39

we always say that well, we want to

13:41

serve our customers, but we will

13:43

only serve our customers if it's good for

13:45

us. Yes. And so once

13:47

that comp plan gets in the way

13:49

of us helping our customers selling them,

13:52

solving problems with them, getting them to their

13:54

vision, then I think now you've now we've

13:57

kind of forgotten about the whole reason we're

13:59

here. That's all. whole other thing, isn't it? Let's

14:02

talk about that. That's really good.

14:04

Let's like a sub topic here

14:06

around compensation compensation plans. How

14:09

do we coach sales people

14:12

to carry good intention when

14:14

they know that a certain product that they

14:16

sell has a higher commission level to it

14:18

or that sort of thing. That's a real

14:21

slippery slope. Yeah, what's your what's your take

14:23

on that? You go into a new client,

14:25

they show you the bill,

14:27

you know, for you know, we pay 10% on

14:30

this stuff. But if our team sells this, we

14:32

want to sell this thing over here, they get

14:34

20% commission on that. What do you think, Bill?

14:39

Bill? And

14:41

they're proud of it. Hey, good one here, huh?

14:46

Yeah, that that's a tough one. Because it

14:48

gets into, well, what's

14:50

my integrity? What am I holding integrity through

14:53

the thing? Because I have no problem selling

14:55

something that pays me more commission if it's

14:57

in fact better for the customer or it's

14:59

a longer term solution or it it does

15:01

this one thing better. And this one thing

15:03

is what I have no problem with that.

15:05

I think that's fine. But but

15:08

yeah, when you cross the line between, well,

15:10

it's really not better for the customer, it's

15:12

just more money, then it's like,

15:14

okay, well, I don't know.

15:16

It just it just feels like a little bit of potential

15:19

for loss of integrity. Yes. I

15:22

had a situation like that where I was being sold to.

15:26

And I was being proposed a

15:28

product. And I just

15:30

didn't feel right to me. Like, I'm like, for

15:33

this, I'm like, this, this doesn't feel right. So

15:35

I have a couple other friends who are in this particular

15:37

industry. And I asked them, I said, Hey, this person proposed

15:40

this product to me doesn't feel right to me. Both

15:43

of the other people, so as two

15:45

other people that are personal friends of

15:47

mine, that are in this industry, they

15:49

said that that product they're trying to sell

15:51

you is like 10x commission

15:53

over normal products. Both of them said

15:56

that like, is

15:59

like no. And

16:01

I just felt that just like and then all the trust,

16:04

you know, I mean, it's not totally

16:06

gone, but it's like dang it, you

16:08

know, yeah, really, really careful with that

16:10

when we're and I think this starts

16:13

with the company of, you know, you're setting your people

16:15

up for this to occur by by

16:17

engaging in this, you

16:20

know, heavy compensation on certain

16:22

product lines and things like that. Yeah,

16:25

plus I think companies are always

16:27

looking for products that expand their

16:29

footprint too. So I've got product

16:31

A and if I add some

16:33

features and turn it into product

16:35

B and I can charge, you

16:38

know, three X for product

16:40

B and we still have product A. Now,

16:43

now I'm going to have a dilemma within the sales

16:45

team because some sales are going to say, well, I'm

16:47

sell product B because I get paid a lot more

16:49

on a higher commission. So some

16:51

of that has to do with product

16:53

development and product selection and say, well,

16:56

maybe we should just discontinue product. Right.

16:58

Exactly. Let's let's be a higher commission.

17:00

That's the only product. We're not, we're

17:02

not, you know, how many times

17:04

have you gone into a company and I'm guilty

17:06

of this too. It's just, we just have too

17:08

many products. I mean, I've got too many services,

17:10

too many practices. Yeah. It's because we're always adding

17:12

or adding. It's like adding an addition to a

17:14

house and another part of the house and another

17:17

part. And then you look at the house. You're

17:19

like, what the hell? Who designed that? Well, seven

17:21

people designed that adding to

17:23

it. And so if you have, if

17:25

you're a CEO and you've got a lot of products

17:27

and they start to overlap and there's a potential loss

17:29

of integrity. Maybe you just show some of those products.

17:31

I think it's a great thing to do. Simplify.

17:34

Got to be in a camp camp.

17:38

Okay. Check out our friends at exactly exactly

17:41

Corp X a CTL

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CTL Y Corp CR R C

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R P dot com. We're

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going to have one of their

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leaders on the show at

17:54

the end of the month here. But really want

17:56

you to check them out because they solve these problems for. Yeah.

18:00

We're wrong on every kid totally listen to

18:02

my first month ago. Yeah, yeah, he's

18:04

kind of miss your way off Anyway,

18:06

so that's it. We'll talk next time a

18:08

little bit about forecasting. Okay, see you next

18:11

time. Yeah