0:00

Welcome to the Dr. Gundry podcast,

0:02

where Dr. Stephen Gundry shares his

0:04

groundbreaking research from over 25 years

0:07

of treating patients with diet and

0:09

lifestyle changes alone. Dr. Gundry and

0:12

other wellness experts offer inspiring stories,

0:14

the latest scientific advancements and practical

0:16

tips to empower you to take

0:18

control of your health and live

0:20

a long, happy life. What

0:23

happens if you only eat

0:25

meat for 30 days? Now,

0:28

you know I don't condone a carnivore

0:31

diet. Not long term, at least. However,

0:33

I have had patients do the

0:35

carnivore diet who are profoundly sensitive

0:37

to plant proteins. And when done

0:39

right, it can be life-changing for

0:41

some. Let me give you

0:43

a very recent example, a very

0:46

dear friend of mine who's been

0:48

a lifelong vegan. And

0:50

get this, a gluten intolerant

0:52

vegan. Talk about difficult. And

0:54

I've traveled around the world

0:56

with him and his partner,

0:58

and I've watched how he

1:00

struggled with health issues and

1:02

of course struggled with finding

1:04

things to eat. And

1:07

it really came to a head

1:09

this fall when we met up

1:11

in Morocco to visit our olive

1:13

oil farm. And he

1:15

related that ever since he had been to

1:17

Hong Kong a couple of months earlier, he

1:19

had gotten some gastric

1:22

disease of whatever. Massive

1:25

diarrhea, never really subsided,

1:27

things kept getting worse. And the

1:30

conversation came up, you know, have

1:32

you ever considered just doing

1:34

a carnivore diet for a month? That's all

1:37

I ask. Because he didn't have an ethical

1:39

reason to be a vegan. He said, you

1:41

know, I'm so desperate now, I'm so miserable,

1:43

I will try anything. So

1:46

we prepared him and

1:48

January 1st of this year,

1:51

he embarked on a carnivore diet. Now

1:53

this was great news to his partner

1:55

who actually enjoyed animal protein. So

1:57

he did the carnivore diet for The

2:00

day. And let me tell you

2:02

it was life changing for him. His G

2:04

I your shoes went away. His.

2:06

Strength in energy returned. He.

2:09

Noticed that he actually was developing

2:11

a six pack for the first

2:13

time in many years and this

2:15

is a devout athlete. Works.

2:18

Out everyday with a personal

2:20

trainer and he notice tons

2:22

of positive changes now. Should.

2:25

He continue on this course and

2:28

that's actually where we are with

2:30

his progression right now, so using

2:33

it as a tool to stop

2:35

the assault of the got wall

2:37

by plant proteins like electrons. And.

2:40

Other plant defense proteins is

2:42

one thing, but whether the

2:45

benefits long term is another.

2:48

Know. What do we know? So.

2:50

Far About the effects of a

2:52

Condo or Die. While we know,

2:54

one thing is that the gut

2:57

microbiome changes dramatically with a carnivore.the

2:59

gut microbiome. In. A way.

3:01

His. Location. Location location.

3:04

If you eat i

3:06

primarily plant based diet,

3:08

your gut microbiome evolves.

3:11

To. Have bacteria that

3:13

can take advantage of the

3:15

different summers that are in

3:17

plants. On the other hand,

3:20

if you eat only animal

3:22

protein, your gut microbiome evolves

3:24

so that only those gut

3:26

bacteria that can eat amino

3:29

acids from an amino acids

3:31

and other products Predominant and

3:33

up gut microbiome that can

3:35

eat simple sugars are complex

3:38

sugars least. So you completely

3:40

change what. Sort of bacteria you

3:42

have in your gut now. One.

3:44

of the really important post

3:46

biotic yeah so transmitters that

3:48

i've written about in my

3:50

last two books is hydrogen

3:52

sulfide gas hydrogen sulfide gas

3:54

is the rotten eggs smell

3:56

and believe it or not hydrogen

3:59

sulfide is got a

4:01

very interesting slippery slope that

4:05

some hydrogen sulfide gas is really

4:08

good for you, but too

4:10

much hydrogen sulfide gas is

4:13

very damaging to

4:15

the colon wall. And

4:17

we know that a

4:19

carnivore meat-based diet produces

4:21

excessive amounts of hydrogen

4:24

sulfide. You need some

4:26

but not too much. And from

4:29

what we can tell so far, that too

4:31

much is what you get from a carnivore

4:33

diet. Now is that going to

4:35

cause problems for a month or so? No, I'm

4:37

not saying it is. But long

4:39

term, we need to assess whether or

4:42

not that's something we want to look

4:44

into in terms of heart health, vascular

4:47

health, and even colon health.

4:50

Are there long term studies of a carnivore

4:52

diet? And the answer is no. First of

4:54

all, there is no human society that's

4:57

been studied that has great

4:59

long-term health that follows

5:01

a carnivore diet. Now the

5:04

close example that people use

5:06

is the Maasai of Africa and

5:10

the Inuit, the Eskimos of

5:12

the Arctic. Unfortunately neither of

5:14

those societies have superb long-term

5:16

health. And we can argue

5:18

about why that may be

5:20

the horrible conditions that both

5:22

of them live under. But

5:25

the fact is, we

5:27

don't have a living or

5:29

ancient example of

5:31

a long-term success carnivore

5:33

diet. Now there is overwhelming evidence

5:36

from the blue zones, areas of

5:38

the world where people live longer,

5:41

healthier lives. The one thing

5:43

that all blue zones share in common is

5:46

that they have very little animal

5:48

protein in their diet. Do

5:50

they all have some? Yes, they absolutely do.

5:52

Now why might that be? Well,

5:55

getting back to the carnivore diet. The

5:58

carnivore diet deprives the gut. microbiome

6:00

of soluble fiber that

6:03

gut bacteria need to eat

6:06

to produce one of my favorite

6:08

compounds a short chain

6:10

fatty acid called butyrate or

6:12

butyric acid. Butyrate may be

6:14

the most important signaling compound

6:16

to protect against disease there

6:18

is. Butyrate is the

6:20

sole source of nourishment for the

6:23

cells that line the colon. I'm

6:26

going to say that again. Your colon

6:28

cells don't get their nourishment from what

6:30

we eat from our bloodstream. They

6:32

get it directly from

6:34

butyrate produced by the

6:36

microbiome and they

6:39

have to have soluble fiber

6:41

to produce butyrate. If

6:43

you don't have it then your

6:45

colon cells begin to die, not thrive

6:49

or begin to look funny

6:52

which leads to serious illness. Now

6:55

this is thought to be one

6:57

of the reasons that a high

6:59

red meat diet is associated with

7:01

colon cancer. Now that's number one.

7:04

So the lack of butyrate

7:06

is incredibly important. Butyrate in

7:09

its own is actually a

7:11

very potent anti-cancer compound. It's

7:14

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the other reason that cancer

8:33

might be of concern with

8:35

a carnivore diet is this

8:37

funny sugar molecule that I've

8:39

written about extensively called

8:41

Neu5GC. Neu5GC

8:46

is present in beef, lamb and

8:48

pork. It's a sugar molecule that

8:50

lines the blood vessels of these

8:53

animals. Now you and I have

8:55

a sugar molecule that lines our

8:57

blood vessels called Neu5AC. They

9:02

differ by only one molecule.

9:05

And because they differ by just

9:07

one molecule, Neu5GC

9:11

is abnormal. Neu5AC

9:13

is normal. We can

9:15

make an antibody to

9:18

Neu5GC by

9:20

eating beef, lamb or pork and in susceptible

9:23

people, that

9:25

antibody when it sees

9:28

the lining of our blood vessels

9:30

says whoa, there's a sugar molecule

9:32

that looks very similar to

9:35

what I'm worried about, Neu5GC.

9:38

It's not quite the same but it looks very similar. I'm

9:40

going to attack. And one of the theories

9:43

that I like in heart disease is

9:45

that it is an autoimmune condition. And

9:48

I've written about that extensively in my books.

9:51

So that may explain why

9:54

long-term red meat eaters have

9:56

a higher incidence of

9:58

coronary artery disease. But it gets

10:00

better than that. We know

10:03

that cancer cells tumors can

10:05

use Neu5GC

10:08

to hide from our own

10:11

immune system, to cloak

10:13

themselves. Now we

10:16

don't manufacture Neu5GC,

10:18

we manufacture Neu5AC. The

10:22

point is where the

10:24

cancer cells get Neu5GC to

10:27

hide from our immune system. We

10:29

had to have eaten it.

10:32

So that may explain the

10:34

association between a red

10:36

meat diet and an increased risk of

10:38

cancer. Now I'm the first

10:40

to admit that association does

10:43

not equate with causation.

10:46

But where there's smoke, there's often

10:48

fire. So there's a couple

10:50

of reasons why a carnivore

10:52

diet long term may

10:55

not be the best choice. Today you

10:57

say, I'm not going to

10:59

do a red meat carnivore diet, I'm going

11:01

to have a chicken diet. Well,

11:04

unfortunately most chicken in the United

11:07

States, even organic chicken is

11:09

fed corn and soybeans, even if it's organic corn

11:11

and soybeans. And I've said it over and over

11:13

again, you are what you eat but you are

11:15

what the thing you're eating ate. And

11:18

so numerous times we

11:20

see people on an organic

11:22

chicken diet who actually have

11:24

autoimmune diseases and when we take

11:27

away their healthy organic chicken, their

11:29

autoimmune disease results. Finally,

11:32

the carnivore diet contains far too

11:34

much animal protein. I'm sorry. Dr.

11:36

Walter Longo, my friend at USC,

11:38

the head of the longevity center,

11:41

we both agree that we

11:43

have far too much protein in

11:45

our diets. Dr. Longo has

11:47

an excellent equation that I use in

11:49

my books to tell you the amount

11:51

of protein that you really need in

11:54

your diet and quite frankly, 30 grams

11:57

of protein, maximum 50 grams.

12:00

grams of protein is about all you

12:02

need in your diet. Now why is

12:04

that seemingly so low? Well

12:07

most dietitians don't know that

12:09

every day we recycle about 20

12:12

grams of protein. We make protein in

12:14

our mucus. We make protein in the

12:17

mucus lining of our gut. Our

12:19

cells that line our gut are shed

12:22

into our gut and we

12:24

digest the protein in these cells. We're

12:26

very efficient and that actually

12:28

ends up to be about 20 grams

12:30

of protein that every day we just

12:33

recycle. So when we look at protein

12:35

needs we overestimate because we don't consider

12:37

those recycling. Let me give you a

12:39

great example about how we've just

12:41

vastly overestimated our protein needs. A

12:44

study in 2009 of the American

12:46

Dietetic Association, they took volunteers of

12:48

two age groups, young

12:50

adults and senior citizens. They were given

12:52

30 grams of lean ground

12:55

beef or 90 grams

12:57

of lean ground beef. They

12:59

looked at muscle synthesis and found that

13:01

30 grams of protein completely

13:03

provided for muscle synthesis in

13:06

both the young and the

13:08

old. The 90 grams in

13:11

both groups did absolutely nothing

13:13

more. Nothing more. Sorry folks.

13:16

And even Dr. Longo who believes that old

13:19

people should eat more protein, quite frankly I

13:21

think has very little answer to this and

13:23

we like to debate the subject. But for

13:25

the point is animal

13:27

protein, we don't need much of.

13:30

What happened to the extra 60 grams

13:32

of protein? Well we don't waste energy

13:34

like I mentioned. We convert

13:36

that into sugar and that

13:38

sugar is converted into fat. And

13:41

over and over again like I've written

13:43

about in my book, studies have shown

13:45

that when people are put on a

13:47

high animal protein diet it

13:49

actually increases their risk of diabetes,

13:51

something that none of us want.

13:54

You can do a carnivore

13:56

diet for 30 days, maybe

13:58

60 days. See

14:01

if you're having an

14:03

effect and then start

14:05

to wean yourself off. Check

14:08

the credentials of someone

14:10

who's giving you advice on this.

14:13

Recently, I came across an

14:16

information video on the internet

14:18

and this person seemed to

14:20

have very interesting credentials, is

14:23

a nutritionist and

14:25

this nutritionist had

14:27

a BA degree, that's right,

14:29

her degree was in English

14:32

literature and she had

14:34

a master's degree from the University

14:36

of Phoenix in social

14:38

communication. So this nutritionist

14:40

who was giving out nutrition advice was

14:43

in fact a English major and

14:45

while I would take advice from

14:48

this person on what

14:50

to glean from reading Chaucer, this

14:53

is not the person I probably want

14:55

to get advice on a carnivore diet,

14:58

just saying. Now I'm

15:00

a doc who's monitored diet changes in

15:03

their patients for over 25 years. I

15:06

measure what happens when we modify their diet

15:09

by blood work every 3 months. I like

15:11

to remind people that I used to have

15:13

a dietitian who worked in my office when

15:16

she was first assigned to me, she almost

15:18

quit because what I

15:20

was teaching patients was 180 degrees

15:23

wrong what she had been taught

15:25

as a dietitian. My office

15:28

staff said, hey, don't

15:30

quit, stick around for a few weeks,

15:33

see what you think. Later that year she

15:35

gave me a Christmas card that

15:37

said thank you for letting me see miracles

15:39

every day. She completely did

15:41

a 180 on her nutrition approach

15:43

as I did a 180 on

15:46

how I taught nutrition. So look

15:48

at people who've actually been studying

15:50

patients for over 20 years, day

15:52

in, day out, six days a

15:54

week asking them to

15:56

make dietary changes, asking

15:58

them to make supplements. changes, measuring

16:01

the results, and publishing papers

16:03

about it. Then you

16:06

might want to take their recommendation seriously. Let's

16:08

say you've made it 30 days, and you've

16:10

done what? But you're not convinced that this

16:12

is a long-term solution, and I want

16:14

to try to convince you it's not a long-term solution. How

16:17

do you add things back? The first

16:19

thing I like to do is have you use

16:22

long-cooked tubers. What are tubers?

16:24

These are root vegetables. Things

16:27

like sweet potatoes, things like jicama.

16:30

I'm a big fan of

16:32

Jerusalem artichokes, sometimes called sun

16:34

chokes. Cook them, cook them

16:36

over and over and over

16:38

again. Puree them, make

16:40

them into soups. Add

16:42

the small amounts back into your

16:45

diet. When and if you're tolerating

16:47

that, then take

16:49

light colored vegetables. Even,

16:52

it sounds crazy, take butter

16:54

lettuce. Cook it, make

16:57

it into a soup, homogenize

16:59

it. The more you cook

17:02

it, the more you pressure cook

17:04

things, you will minimize these plant

17:06

defense systems. And you'll

17:08

know when something really gets

17:11

your attention, and just eliminate that from

17:13

your diet. I hope you

17:15

enjoyed this episode of the Dr. Gunji podcast.

17:17

If you did, please share this with family

17:19

and friends. You never know how one of

17:21

these health tips can completely transform someone's life

17:24

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17:26

with them. There's also the Dr. Gunji podcast

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YouTube channel, where we have tens of thousands

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