0:01

Earlier this week, we met up with

0:05

William Medina. William

0:14

is 39 years old, from Colombia.

0:16

He's a food delivery worker, and he's

0:19

gigged for all the major delivery apps in New

0:21

York City. DoorDash, Grubhub,

0:24

Relay, and Uber

0:25

Eats. Here's

0:27

the app. We're going to connect.

0:31

We hit this button to connect. There

0:35

we go. Now we're connected.

0:38

On most days, William is out on the streets

0:40

of New York, waiting for his phone to ping,

0:43

and hoping an order comes through that's worth

0:45

his while.

0:46

Let's

0:48

accept this delivery. The

0:52

pay's not great, but it's nearby, yeah? It's $2.

0:56

So let's hit accept.

1:02

William's one of roughly 65,000 delivery

1:05

workers who could benefit from a new law

1:07

in New York City. It would set

1:09

a minimum wage of about $18

1:11

an hour for app-based delivery

1:13

workers. City officials

1:15

say the law is the first of its kind.

1:18

But the food delivery app companies are

1:20

fighting it, setting up a legal battle

1:23

that could reshape the industry.

1:27

Welcome to The Journal, our show about money,

1:30

business, and power. I'm Jessica

1:32

Mendoza. It's Thursday, October

1:34

5th.

1:40

Coming up on the show, the food

1:42

delivery workers of New York City take

1:45

on the app companies.

2:00

Our colleague Erin Ailworth covers New York

2:02

City for the journal. She says that

2:04

apps have totally changed the way food gets

2:07

delivered. And the shift has raised

2:09

big questions for the industry. The

2:12

companies are trying to figure out, like, how

2:14

do we have a viable business model where

2:16

we, you know, make a profit, right? And

2:19

how do we treat our workers

2:21

right?

2:23

These were the same kinds of questions that city

2:25

lawmakers in New York were asking last

2:27

year. They basically did

2:29

a study, right, that said

2:32

let's look at this work

2:34

environment, if

2:36

you will, and let's

2:38

look at who makes up that

2:40

environment, what kind

2:43

of pay they get, what

2:45

modes of transportation they're

2:47

using to make

2:50

these deliveries, and let's

2:53

analyze that whole sort of ecosystem

2:55

and then decide do we think what

2:57

they're

2:57

already making via what these

2:59

apps pay are they making

3:01

a fair wage? To

3:04

figure that out, the city surveyed delivery

3:06

workers like William Medina,

3:08

who you heard from earlier. He's

3:10

part of a group of delivery workers

3:12

who've been advocating for higher pay.

3:15

A couple days ago our producer, Alan

3:17

Rodriguez Espinosa, hopped on the back

3:19

of William's motorbike and got to tag

3:21

along on several deliveries.

3:24

They met up on a Tuesday.

3:26

William said it was a slow night.

3:28

William reviews each delivery offer and

3:31

does the math. He looks at the pay

3:33

and the time it would take to get to his

3:34

destination. Look, for

3:40

example, here's an offer. I'm not

3:42

going to take this one. It's two deliveries and it

3:44

pays $6.55, so that's too

3:46

low. It's 3.9 miles,

3:49

so if I take that order, it goes up to 91st Street

3:52

and 24th Avenue. Picking up two orders

3:54

and taking them all the way there, that'll

3:56

take more than one hour.

3:59

workers are paid a base rate per trip.

4:02

That rate is set by each app. Workers

4:05

earn tips on top of that. William

4:08

says he works six to seven days a week, sometimes

4:11

for as long as 12 hours a day. But

4:13

to get paid at all, he has to get an order.

4:16

And he says a big chunk of his time, about

4:18

half of it, is spent waiting for

4:20

orders to come in.

4:22

The time

4:26

you spend on the app, it's certain

4:28

it's time making deliveries, and time

4:30

waiting to receive an order. The

4:32

time waiting, you don't get compensated.

4:35

No minimum pay. We call that dead

4:38

time. So right now,

4:40

I'm getting orders that pay too low. So

4:42

as long as the app isn't ringing, I'm

4:44

not making any money at all.

4:52

After more than half an hour of dead time...

4:57

Tell me what just happened and what we're waiting for.

4:59

OK. OK. We've

5:02

just received an order from a restaurant. Uber

5:05

says it'll pay me $2 for this order.

5:08

We're going to drive, I think, two or three

5:10

blocks. Right now, we're going to wait

5:12

for the food, see how long it takes for them to

5:14

make it. Once we have it, we'll

5:16

head to the customer's house and give them the food. William

5:20

picked up the food from a corner burger joint.

5:24

He

5:27

stuck the food into his delivery bag.

5:29

And he drove a few blocks to

5:31

drop off the first order of the night. For

5:33

that trip, Uber paid him $2.

5:36

He didn't get a tip.

5:38

App-based delivery workers like William are

5:41

not full-time employees. They're independent

5:43

contractors,

5:43

gig workers. One

5:46

downside of that is that William is on the

5:48

hook for his own expenses.

5:51

It's like the bike he uses to make deliveries.

5:54

It's a 2011 Yamaha Moped. It's

5:56

black. And William says it cost him $3,500.

6:01

His delivery bag cost him $60. And

6:04

then on top of that, he spent a bunch

6:06

of money on modifications to make his job easier.

6:09

He has a phone holder that lets him look at a map

6:11

and monitor his apps while he drives.

6:13

That was $35. He also

6:15

got a GPS tracker in case his bike gets

6:18

stolen. That was $60 plus a $21 monthly

6:20

service fee.

6:23

In 2022, I think it was in January. In

6:30

the winter, I was the victim of

6:32

a theft. Four young

6:34

men jumped me here in Long Island City. They

6:37

took my bike. There's

6:39

a lot of other workers here. So we have radio,

6:41

we have GPS. And

6:43

thankfully, my coworkers and I were able to

6:45

communicate and get me my bike back. But

6:49

the day they stole my bike, they threatened me with a

6:51

knife. They pulled a weapon on me

6:53

and insulted me. For

6:55

a while, I was very afraid and

6:57

I didn't want to work. I didn't

6:59

want to make deliveries or ride my bike anymore.

7:04

Do you feel that what you're making right now is

7:07

fair for the work that you do?

7:09

No. No, no, no. No,

7:12

I don't think it's fair. Because

7:18

well, in my case, I have to pay rent. I

7:20

think all of us, we pay rent. We

7:22

all need money to eat, to pay bills.

7:26

I think for me, what I make for my work and

7:28

my deliveries, I don't make enough money

7:30

for anything extra.

7:34

New York City officials looked at what delivery

7:36

workers like William were making and what

7:38

they spent on work-related equipment. The

7:41

city found that what these workers wound

7:43

up taking home after expenses was $11 an hour

7:46

on average. And that was with

7:48

tips. Without tips,

7:50

it was closer to $4 an hour.

7:53

These findings led to the new law

7:55

that was passed in June. The

7:58

app companies didn't like it. I like it. I

8:01

like it. I like it.

8:03

I like it. I like it. I like

8:05

it. I like it. I like it.

8:08

I like it. I like it.

8:10

I like it. Courage. I learned

8:12

it from my adoptive

8:12

mom. Hold my hand. You hold my

8:14

hand. Learn

8:16

about adopting a teen from foster care at adoptuskids.org.

8:20

You can't imagine the reward. Brought to you by AdoptUSKids,

8:22

the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services and the Ad Council.

8:32

So let's back up a little bit. New York

8:34

City passes this law to boost

8:36

pay for delivery workers. How

8:38

does the law work? So there

8:41

are two ways that the pay

8:43

rate works, and the

8:46

app companies get to decide what

8:48

they think is the mode they want

8:50

to use.

8:51

That's our colleague Erin again.

8:53

You can either pay $17.96 an hour, or you

8:55

can pay $0.50 for every minute that you are

8:58

active.

9:04

And they have issues

9:06

with both of those.

9:09

In New York City, four app companies

9:12

dominate the food delivery market. DoorDash,

9:15

Grubhub, Uber Eats, and

9:17

New York-based Relay. Soon

9:20

after city lawmakers passed the minimum wage

9:22

law in June, those same four companies

9:25

pushed back, and they took the city

9:27

to court. So the delivery app companies

9:30

came out pretty quickly and

9:32

filed suits saying,

9:34

hey, listen, we're all

9:37

for, you know, fair

9:40

and minimum wage, but we

9:42

don't think that the way this has

9:44

been designed works.

9:47

You know, one of the things that

9:49

they argue is that under the pay rate

9:52

model where you're paying for

9:55

the active time on the app,

9:57

right, the active delivery time, they're

9:59

saying

9:59

saying, hey, some of those delivery

10:02

workers are on

10:04

multiple apps at once. So does that mean

10:06

that we're going to be like DoorDash

10:09

and Grubhub are going to be paying the same

10:11

delivery worker at the same time? And

10:15

is that fair?

10:17

By raising wages, essentially, what

10:20

are they saying the effects might be? They're

10:22

basically saying that it's going to

10:25

be a loss of flexibility

10:28

and it's going to be like that they're going to

10:30

have to pass

10:31

on the cost to customers,

10:34

right? So it's going to be you're

10:36

paying more for the

10:39

service and they're also going to have

10:41

to put restrictions on

10:44

when workers can work, you

10:46

know, and how they access the app.

10:50

The app companies said that the city

10:52

used flawed surveys

10:54

and that it should have included grocery deliveries

10:56

in its study.

10:58

The companies also said that the delivery

11:00

workers minimum wage might end up

11:02

higher than what's set for other industries.

11:06

The minimum wage rules were supposed to take effect

11:08

in July, but when the company sued,

11:10

they requested a preliminary injunction and

11:13

a judge put a hold on the law change. Things

11:16

were at a standstill. Then last week,

11:19

the judge lifted the hold while he continues

11:21

to consider their lawsuits.

11:23

The judge said, hey, Uber,

11:25

Grubhub and DoorDash, I don't think you actually

11:27

rate a preliminary injunction

11:31

so the city can go ahead and institute

11:33

these new wages

11:36

for these delivery workers.

11:39

And how big of a deal is that for

11:40

delivery workers?

11:42

It's a pretty big deal. I mean, they were

11:44

celebrating this as a win.

11:47

Now,

11:48

it's a significant step forward. This

11:51

is not the final decision in

11:53

the case, though.

11:55

The judge did grant the injunction to Relay,

11:58

which he said had demonstrated that it had had

12:00

a different business model than the other apps.

12:02

DoorDash, Grubhub, and Uber Eats have

12:05

signaled that they plan to keep fighting the law.

12:08

The companies have indicated that

12:10

they

12:10

are going to appeal. So those

12:13

appeals will be made, and then we

12:15

will wait for a judge to

12:17

decide what to do about those appeals. There

12:20

is probably going to be a pause while

12:22

that appeal is heard.

12:25

God bless the court system. That's right. It's

12:28

a lot

12:28

of small legal footsteps

12:32

until we get to a big decision. Do

12:34

you think this kind of law can be

12:36

replicated in other cities, or

12:38

is this something that is unique

12:41

to New York City? Other cities

12:43

are likely watching this, right? And

12:47

if this does go through and is

12:49

implemented in New York, I

12:52

would imagine that there will be

12:54

some sort of repercussion or

12:56

ripple effect because

12:59

the companies will be

13:01

figuring out how to abide by whatever it is

13:04

that is put in place. And

13:08

does that mean that they're going to have different

13:10

rules for different states? I don't know yet, but

13:12

I think everybody is watching.

13:15

What

13:16

is your biggest takeaway

13:17

from your reporting on this issue?

13:20

Personally? Personally,

13:22

I need to tip delivery workers

13:25

more. It's

13:27

a tough job. I had no

13:30

idea what it was like

13:32

to really do these jobs.

13:34

I only knew it from the customer

13:37

perspective

13:39

of, yes, my pizza

13:41

got here when they said it would

13:44

or it didn't. And

13:46

now I like, honestly,

13:49

I'm like, as long as I get a meal, I'm good.

13:51

I mean, I would like it to be warmer,

13:53

cold, as the meal dictates.

13:56

But

13:59

it's a tough job.

14:03

Our producer, Alan, tagged along with William

14:06

for one more delivery the other night. It

14:08

was from a liquor store to an apartment in

14:10

Queens. It was an $8 order, $5

14:14

base pay from Uber Eats, and a $3 tip.

14:17

So

14:20

we've been connected to the Uber

14:22

Eats app for around an hour

14:24

and a half, and you've made

14:27

about $10 in tips. $10 in

14:30

total. How

14:32

do you feel about that? I'm

14:34

frustrated. You

14:38

hope that the new minimum

14:40

wage law is going to make

14:43

a difference? A huge difference.

14:47

Absolutely.

14:57

I'm available

15:00

for today, Thursday, October 5th.

15:03

The journal is a co-production of Spotify

15:05

and the Wall Street Journal.

15:06

Additional reporting from FICA Harada.

15:09

Thanks for listening. See

15:14

you tomorrow.