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0:30

I am unwilling to give up. But

0:33

I will start over from scratch as

0:35

many times as it takes to

0:38

get where I want to be. I just want to make

0:40

sure you will get knocked down, but just make sure you

0:42

don't get knocked out. So

0:44

your only choice should be, go focus on

0:47

what you can control. Hi

0:49

everyone and welcome to the Kara of Golden

0:51

show. So join me each

0:53

week for inspiring conversations with some

0:55

of the world's greatest leaders. We'll

0:58

talk with founders, entrepreneurs, CEOs,

1:00

and really some of the

1:03

most interesting people of our

1:05

time. Can't wait to

1:07

get started. Let's go.

1:10

Let's go. Hi everyone and

1:13

welcome back to the Kara

1:15

Golden show. We are so

1:17

excited to have our next

1:19

guest here. We have Carmel

1:21

Hagan, who is the founder

1:23

and CEO of Supernatural. And

1:25

you may be familiar with

1:28

Supernatural. We'll get into some

1:30

of their partnerships that they

1:32

have. They're very, very exciting.

1:34

But Supernatural is a premium

1:36

plant-based modern baking essentials brand,

1:38

making food colors, vegan sprinkles,

1:41

and allergy friendly rainbow chocolate

1:43

chips. And they're absolutely

1:45

delicious. They make those yummy cookies

1:47

and cupcakes and all the other

1:50

great things that you're making at

1:52

home. Extra, extra yummy. And

1:56

Also doing it in a way that

1:58

is disrupting an industry that is.. Ah,

2:00

maybe not surprisingly not so great

2:02

for you by I was very

2:05

very interested as I was researching

2:07

the company overall. So they're the

2:09

only locally made and women

2:11

lad seeking brands to who's

2:14

colorful products are made entirely

2:16

from natural and plant based

2:18

sources. I. Ads.

2:21

Eyes she is a Tory

2:23

Burch fellow, some super super

2:25

foreign and also a former

2:28

former child. Pillsbury Bake Off

2:30

winner the I thought would

2:32

have been so. Much fallen. I'm

2:34

sure I want to hear all about

2:37

that. and they're setting a new industry

2:39

standards. For the baking essentials

2:41

category, that is, Very

2:43

daring to say the least.

2:46

And also I've just really

2:48

chill in it so I'm

2:50

very very excited to have

2:53

you here today! Carmel! So

2:55

welcome. Dangerous. So it's

2:57

an experience as a fan and it

2:59

is a thrilled offered another girl that

3:01

the text. Started from turn Cpg

3:04

founder of Things Are Happening

3:06

He. Yeah. Absolutely. so.

3:08

It's such an interesting story.

3:10

I mean, obviously every time

3:12

I look at that section

3:14

in the store that has,

3:16

though, Writing. Frosting and

3:19

the sprinkles. It's way.

3:21

It's. Gonna. Put that extra,

3:24

you know? Beauty. On

3:26

or whatever you're creating, but you

3:28

really want that on there and

3:30

a youth solve. That problem.

3:33

So tell me the story behind it.

3:35

Obviously you hadn't been in this industry.

3:37

Ah, know what gave you the i'd

3:39

yet to go and do that? And

3:42

i'm like been checked for about a decade

3:44

the be i feel with always to send

3:46

a bunch of time and started i come

3:48

from entire family with and of the serial

3:50

entire museum led me to get your Mph

3:53

in the real world of the on the

3:55

ladder fact that he can attack started in

3:57

and started. and

3:59

After a decade, I just

4:02

could not fathom starting a tech startup.

4:04

I was craving, like every part of

4:06

my being was craving real

4:08

atoms and less binary, you know? So

4:11

of course, being like an

4:13

entrepreneurial type, instead of joining

4:15

someone else's food startup, which would have been

4:17

a great way to learn the industry, I

4:20

decided to order you know, like a couple

4:22

palates of coconut sugar myself and bring them

4:25

over from Indonesia. So I just made a big

4:27

leap. I decided I was going to

4:30

start with coconut sugar, which is a far cry

4:33

from where we landed. But the

4:35

story is, instead of like passion to bake

4:37

for my whole life, and

4:39

was so impressed by coconut sugar's

4:42

ability to sort of slip into all these traditional

4:45

recipes without major recipe modifications, like when

4:47

you use honey, you have to change

4:49

everything. You use maple syrup, you have

4:51

to change everything. And coconut sugar,

4:53

I didn't have to change anything. We

4:55

made a beautiful end product and

4:57

seemed like nobody knew about it. So

4:59

coming out of tech, I was

5:01

like, you know what, let's just start with coconut

5:03

sugar. If I can do a good job getting

5:06

this a brand that makes it approachable

5:08

and understood by people other

5:10

than sort of like the

5:12

paleo ultra kind of

5:14

healthy audience that I've previously been a fan

5:17

of it, then from that

5:19

point on, I'll see if the rest of this world is

5:21

really for me. So were you

5:23

a baker? Or like what

5:25

would you were you a chef? I

5:27

mean, had you been classically trained to

5:29

do any of this? Oh,

5:31

God, no. So I want you know,

5:34

so many people that have a

5:36

passionate hobby, as long as they're curious enough,

5:38

you do get to a point of I'm

5:42

in no way professional, but I

5:45

could produce a professional

5:47

level product inside the kitchen, then

5:49

very narrow realm. So

5:51

I think I was at that level with baking,

5:53

you know, I had sort of moved away from

5:55

cookies gotten into things that were a little bit

5:58

more technical and just really enjoying the And

6:00

of course coming out of tech also

6:02

just the instant. And

6:05

this has been something that I think still is

6:07

so much part of why supernatural

6:09

exists. But the pleasure of

6:12

having an idea that then hours

6:14

later instead of years, whatever later is

6:16

a real thing. I

6:18

think always for me, that ability to create

6:20

something with my hands, with my mind and

6:22

bring it into the real world is always

6:25

such a reward. So

6:27

that's, yeah, I am not. I had

6:30

no business doing anything that I was

6:32

doing. Oh, like starting

6:34

that company, no business at all,

6:36

but we did it. And

6:38

it did already, got into whole

6:40

foods. After

6:43

six months there, I still

6:45

felt incredibly uncomfortable. Like, oh my God, that

6:47

first year of starting a food company what

6:50

an uncomfortable year that was. It

6:52

was by far the hardest. I

6:55

was so nervous all the time. So not like me, like

6:57

I drive from the gut. I'm so decisive. And

7:00

that year I did not, you know, it

7:02

was terrifying. But by

7:04

the end of it, I knew not only

7:07

that it's what I really wanted to be doing with

7:09

a serious amount of my time, but

7:12

that I knew exactly where the biggest

7:14

problem was in that aisle. And I was gonna

7:16

go solve that. And that was

7:18

the decorative segment. Your

7:21

business was humming, but now you're seeing

7:23

it falling short on what's needed. Your

7:25

team that has shown up and

7:27

outperformed through all the chaotic

7:29

twists and turns over the past few

7:32

years seems buried in too much manual

7:34

work and is taking forever to close

7:37

the books. Having one single

7:39

source of truth would be the

7:41

dream, yet it seems so difficult

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love it. So before you got into

10:22

Whole Foods, I would imagine you had a

10:24

business plan of some sort and

10:28

what were the first what

10:30

was the first skill or first skills that

10:32

you decided you needed to kind of master

10:35

before you could actually get it into someplace like

10:37

Whole Foods? Before

10:40

we even got to the point

10:42

where we were

10:44

confident pitching it to

10:46

a door, we had to really

10:49

validate. I'm sure you know a lot

10:51

of people listening to this. I'm sure you know

10:53

that when you used to go into a natural

10:55

grocery store, there was no decorative section and

10:58

if there was anything, if there was a sprinkle,

11:00

it was very sad. It just looked like a

11:02

sad old couch and if there was a set

11:05

of food colors, you'd take them home and everything

11:07

would be brown or everything would be pale. So

11:10

the obvious opportunity that we saw, which

11:13

was to build out the decorative category

11:15

for the natural baking aisle, was

11:17

also kind of tempered by this scary knowledge

11:19

that like wait, it looks like there's a

11:22

lot of evidence that maybe this doesn't work

11:24

because nobody else has been able to do

11:26

it. It doesn't even like does it not

11:28

exist because no one's taken that opportunity or

11:30

does it not exist because there is

11:32

no opportunity? So the first

11:35

step for me in my home kitchen,

11:37

which was so fun and

11:39

one of my favorite memories for this

11:41

whole process of building supernatural was collecting

11:44

almost a hundred different samples of

11:46

natural food color from

11:48

all of these different regulated

11:50

color providers and testing

11:53

them on my own for does it work in eggs?

11:55

Does it work in the oven? What happens if it's

11:57

getting exposed to heat? What happens if it's getting exposed

11:59

to heat? getting exposed to acid. What's happening,

12:01

you know, all these different test

12:04

cases that a colorant, which can

12:06

go into anything, you know, it's

12:08

not like you're making a baking

12:11

mix and it's going to make them up

12:13

in no matter what. Like a colorant could

12:15

go into a million different things, including by

12:17

the way, weirdly, like kids bathtub, you know,

12:19

like kids put color in their bathtub, but

12:21

like that's a colorful format. So

12:23

we really just tried to test every use case

12:25

that we could. And I think through that, that's

12:28

when I really was able to say

12:30

this hasn't happened yet because it's

12:33

an innovation problem because no one's done it

12:35

the right way because nobody really understands which

12:38

ones to give to customers yet. And so

12:40

that's what I had to figure out on

12:42

my own before I even went

12:44

there. And then once we

12:46

realized that that's when I said, okay, let's

12:49

launch with a really

12:51

funky, crazy sprinkle that is

12:53

not just like a boring pink sprinkle in a

12:55

jar. Let's show everybody just how

12:58

our natural can go. And

13:00

then let's do a natural food coloring product.

13:03

So the very small, we launched with

13:05

a very small little capsule at our

13:07

northeast falsehood in New York

13:09

City, the northeast region. That's awesome.

13:12

And so, so just that you

13:14

just had that one skew or so we've launched

13:16

a natural food coloring set, which was the same

13:18

one that we have today. It's one of the

13:21

top selling natural food colors on Amazon. So it's

13:23

like a four pack of color

13:25

powders. And then we launched

13:27

with, I think it was

13:29

two sprinkles. So starfetti, and then there

13:32

was one starfetti, which is sort of

13:35

our baby, our first born.

13:38

It was a mix of many different

13:40

colors of stars, open stars, closed stars,

13:42

and some little dots. And then we

13:44

launched a more basic sprinkle that was

13:46

called white sequins just to see if

13:48

people kind of like wanted, we

13:51

just know maybe they wanted that more boring one

13:53

because all you ever found in the grocery stores

13:55

was the boring ones. And so I was like,

13:57

well, maybe that's what people want. It's just me over

13:59

here wanting. these crazy confetti shapes that we tested

14:01

both. And guess what? The white one didn't

14:04

last. That didn't last. I was going to ask

14:07

you, were there any things in the initial phase

14:09

that sort of didn't

14:11

fly? It's interesting. We have many

14:13

things. When we were launching hints,

14:15

one of them, and it actually

14:17

lasted probably longer than we should

14:19

have allowed it to last, but

14:21

cucumber. We found that

14:23

cucumber, you know, you either,

14:25

it's very polarizing. You either really

14:28

love cucumber water or you hate

14:30

it. And we would have hysterical

14:32

stories from,

14:36

actually, really funny, from

14:39

all from the East Coast, not

14:41

from the West Coast, typically New

14:43

Yorkers, would tell us like, we really

14:45

like your product. It's great. But

14:47

we're, one email that

14:50

was shared with us told us that he

14:52

was offended by the fact

14:55

that there was cucumber in the water and

14:57

he just like couldn't get past it. And,

15:00

you know, he was, he was like,

15:02

I don't care what the people in LA

15:04

want, but I don't ever want to see

15:06

it. And I mean, it was just, and

15:09

I just used to laugh at those letters,

15:11

because I just thought anybody would actually

15:14

take the time to even, even if

15:16

we're not doing exactly what he

15:19

wants us to do. I mean,

15:21

that's a really powerful thing. And did

15:23

you, have you ever gotten an email,

15:25

maybe not a cucumber one, but have

15:27

you ever gotten an email like that,

15:30

that you're just, you know, you're,

15:32

you're not thrilled on one side, but

15:34

then you're also like, wow, he

15:37

loves what we're doing. And we just

15:39

have to, you know,

15:41

tweak something. You

15:43

know, I think it's so funny that the

15:45

New Yorkers were like, hell no on that. That

15:47

is not for me. That's sort of vibes with

15:54

what, with what is true. But we

15:56

get, you know, we, We

16:00

get interesting pieces

16:03

of data and feedback all the time. Like

16:05

Amazon comments are my favorite place to go

16:07

and read. And just like you said, yeah,

16:10

sometimes they are, there's

16:12

so much passion in such a good direction.

16:14

And sometimes it's a different kind of fashion

16:16

that's maybe not as useful.

16:19

And yet it's still driven by some things.

16:21

So yeah, yeah, yeah, long winded. But absolutely,

16:23

we get that stuff off the chain. All

16:26

that stuff. I always share

16:29

with entrepreneurs too, especially people

16:31

that haven't launched their product yet

16:34

because it's not perfect. You're

16:37

going to do some sort of change

16:39

right after you launch, whether it's you're going

16:42

to kill a skew, you're going

16:44

to change packaging. We've had

16:46

many stories of people thinking

16:49

that their product packaging was perfect

16:52

when it launched. And we

16:54

have a story around the fact

16:56

that we launched with clear labels. I wanted

16:59

the entire product to be clear. And

17:01

what we couldn't control was the lighting in stores

17:03

or who we were going to be sitting

17:05

next to on the shelf and it would

17:07

just get lost. And so that's when we

17:10

went to the white label and we 10Xed

17:12

our sales overnight just by going to a

17:15

white more vibrant label. So

17:17

it's lots of stories like

17:20

that. But the

17:22

lesson learned, I guess, is that

17:24

it will never be

17:27

perfect. And the best entrepreneurs are

17:29

constantly iterating. And what would you

17:31

say to that? Absolutely.

17:33

I mean, every decision for me

17:36

comes down to context. You can never

17:38

make the best decision unless you have

17:41

the best context. And launching

17:43

something new, you will

17:45

never have perfect context. You can do

17:47

a great job creating a thesis and

17:49

creating an iteration based on your thesis.

17:52

You know, kind of just like agile

17:54

development in tech. And then you

17:56

need to keep your ear to the ground and. That

18:00

whatever you learned can make something better. You know?

18:02

I think there's sort of the pressure to do

18:04

something perfect coming right out of the game. And.

18:08

The. Pressure should only be to do something good

18:10

and. Researched. Answers town coming out

18:12

of the game. As. With awareness

18:15

that the research process. Is.

18:18

Gonna. Happen every day of your life. You know you're

18:20

going to start a natural enough. One type of

18:23

research that you're gonna got a conventional

18:25

at. Another type of research gonna hop

18:27

on over to been bark that's another

18:29

planet. Consumer different had contacts and all

18:31

of these data that. Feed

18:33

into what he needs to be this year

18:35

and a year after. That and the year after

18:37

that. you know there's no such thing as perfect. Very

18:39

such thing as good. I.

18:41

Totally agree. So do you feel

18:44

like in the eye in the

18:46

it. Industry. As a

18:48

whole, the baking essential industry.is

18:50

that. I are most people

18:52

have. They moved over that natural. Colors,

18:56

Or are we still kind of

18:58

in that artifice soul And he

19:00

and others there's certainly can be

19:02

that South Bay or Bathhouse not

19:04

moves at all. Ah, five is

19:06

it. Do you feel like. There.

19:09

Are a lot of stores for

19:11

canoe pudding? Not pressure on or

19:13

as a feeling like consumers you

19:15

know want that. Are. They

19:18

aware I got at other Cia.

19:20

As you know obviously that consumers

19:22

that are coming over to you

19:24

are. But. How do you

19:27

get people? To. Be aware and

19:29

I just sort. Of. The second question

19:31

is. What is in

19:33

a lot of those are

19:35

sprinkles that are non supernatural.

19:38

That a questionable. A

19:41

manifesto Thirst Oh money. Into

19:44

saying. Things. To answer

19:46

best about ten sessions in

19:48

her sense, like a servant

19:50

eaten. Be. to

19:52

mention definite death that the the sense that

19:55

you find a single day for a and

19:57

you actually be like a good price express

19:59

v epic to sprinkles and decorative

20:01

frostings, which are kind of the squeezy colorful

20:04

ones, and even like little sugar

20:06

shapes and icing

20:08

gels. So those are the same products

20:11

that have been on those shelves for about 30 to

20:13

40 years. And

20:15

all of those products, the ingredients within

20:17

them are the ones that were sort

20:20

of approved also in the 60s and

20:22

70s. So like it's a very, it's

20:24

an incredibly old set that

20:26

has not been prodded with

20:28

nearly as much development

20:31

as any other category in the grocery store. And

20:34

you know, consumers are actually

20:36

very aware about that. They'll list the

20:38

consumer will list corn syrup, they'll list artificial

20:40

colors, they'll list artificial preservatives in the top

20:42

five of things they want to avoid. Like

20:45

this is Nielsen, this is an everyday person,

20:47

it's not like a natural shopper. So people

20:49

really do have a lot of generalized awareness

20:51

that these things are bad for them. However,

20:55

within the banking aisle itself,

20:58

what we found up until

21:00

pretty recently was that it's

21:02

not just the bank account, there are categories

21:04

inside grocery stores that are just sort

21:07

of the part inside of an

21:09

aisle that the buyer wants to spend

21:11

the least amount of time thinking about

21:13

because it's, you know, it's just

21:16

it's kind of a sleepy area and they're not, the

21:18

industry's not giving it a lot of pressure, they're not

21:20

giving it a lot of pressure, it sort of has

21:22

a good, a good foundation

21:24

for just status quo, like that's sort

21:26

of like why it is what it is and

21:28

why it's continuing that way. And decorative has been

21:31

one of those areas. So

21:33

in natural there has been no pressure to

21:36

revise it because there hasn't been one, right?

21:38

Like it never existed, they had their planagram filled

21:40

up of other stuff, there's plenty of other things

21:42

to put there. And then

21:44

over in conventional, there was no

21:46

alternative, you know, up until Supernatural

21:48

started, there was less than one

21:51

percent of all of the decorative

21:53

products in the world even had a natural alternative.

21:55

So like there wasn't even a market for these

21:57

things. So we have

21:59

had, a really interesting

22:01

first, I would say five

22:03

years, we kind of

22:06

avoided retail. We were very soft in

22:08

retail because it was such a challenging

22:11

pitch because there wasn't

22:13

improvement. There wasn't, they're not

22:15

getting pressure from the top to redo their sprinkles

22:17

back. There's like plenty going on in flour and

22:19

sugar during the pandemic. Like don't worry, we need

22:21

to make more space for all that anyway. And

22:26

then what we would do

22:28

is instead we'd we

22:30

are, we know that every day is not

22:32

where you're going to be doing your trials.

22:35

So let's look at holiday. And so we

22:37

started to build a really significant in out

22:39

seasonal business as our first big retail push

22:41

while simultaneously investing a ton into Amazon to

22:44

sort of build up the brand awareness and

22:47

start to find out in

22:49

our own data backed way, whether our

22:51

products were resonating with regular customers. The

22:53

Amazon customer is everybody, you know, it's

22:55

not just natural. It's not too much.

22:57

It's everybody. And then

23:00

more recently, what has been happening

23:03

is that as California has banned red dye

23:05

number three, and then New York in December

23:07

followed Sue with a ban on not just

23:09

red dye number three, but a number of

23:12

other things that are commonly found in those

23:14

products as well. The buyers

23:16

now, you know, everyone from William Sonoma

23:18

to just like people in the middle

23:20

of America, they have to

23:22

start looking at these things because in 2027, they

23:25

have to have all of these things out there set and

23:27

red dye number three is just like in everything in the

23:29

decorative set. So we kind of waited

23:31

for a moment. We're waiting for it. We

23:34

waited for a moment. We have an

23:36

amazing moment. And what we're seeing sort

23:38

of more on the consumer side is,

23:40

you know, for example, on Amazon last

23:42

year, just the organic searches for natural

23:45

sprinkles, it was up 108%. But that's

23:47

not, that's not as

23:50

bad searches like these are just consumer searches.

23:52

So more and more looking

23:54

for this as the awareness

23:56

increases. And so when

23:59

you think about about like

24:01

the Amazon consumer. And I know

24:03

you also recently went into Sprouts.

24:06

That's amazing. I mean, you're growing in all

24:09

different retail locations. You've

24:11

also got partnerships with major brands

24:13

like Milk Bar, which I'm sure

24:15

many people have heard of. So

24:18

can you share more about those

24:20

kind of opportunities? How do you

24:22

see the brands? Obviously you're very

24:24

omni-channel, but it's also you're an

24:27

add-on to actually help other brands

24:29

really speak to

24:33

what they want to share. Yeah.

24:35

So it's been part of

24:37

our game one. We

24:40

knew that most

24:42

people have sprinkles in their pantry, but

24:44

most people are encountering sprinkles on a

24:46

regular basis at their favorite coffee shop

24:48

where they're encountering them on their pouchie

24:50

bar or on a cookie. So

24:53

the way that we've modeled Supernatural

24:55

has always been, we need

24:57

to build towards food service. We need to slowly put

24:59

the groundwork in for food service. And

25:02

that was one of the big steps that we

25:04

were finally able to make a couple of

25:06

years ago. Initially we had to manufacture

25:08

overseas because no sprinkle manufacturers in America,

25:12

number one, really had the capabilities to do what

25:14

we wanted to do with natural sprinkles. But number

25:16

two, the MOQs are so

25:18

insane to get into this business. Sprinkle

25:21

manufacturing, especially if you want to make a

25:24

sprinkle that has multiple shapes in it,

25:26

it is so preservative to make something

25:28

super cute until you can purchase like

25:31

tens of thousands of pounds of sprinkles. So

25:33

we were manufacturing overseas where

25:36

the MOQs were lower. We

25:38

were able to move it to America because we

25:40

were big enough. And at that

25:42

point, we were in a good price,

25:45

a good price position to open up food

25:47

service. And so, yeah, with

25:49

people like Milk Bar, also with another

25:51

one that fewer people know about, Dr.

25:53

Prager, which is a great brand,

25:56

frozen, lots of kids' food, we

25:58

were able to use it. some innovation that

26:01

we did in natural colors to

26:03

bring to them natural frosting that

26:05

for the

26:07

first time were maintaining their color inside

26:09

their natural product, which has always been

26:11

this huge struggle and continues to be.

26:13

We didn't sell them everything. It can

26:15

continue to be a big struggle. But

26:18

we launched a sprinkle that has just been

26:20

crushing it for people like Dr. Priggers and

26:22

Pro Mix and Milk Bar and a

26:25

large sample of smaller ice cream

26:27

shops and bakeries around America that

26:29

are just looking to get away from

26:31

nasty sprinkles. I

26:33

love it. So you were a Tory

26:35

Burch fellow. Can you share more

26:38

about what that means?

26:40

How did that get developed? What did you

26:42

learn from being a part of that? Absolutely.

26:45

So Tory Burch is

26:48

an incredible entrepreneur. And

26:52

I think we know that from the outside. And then when you

26:54

go on the inside and really see how

26:57

that company is run, it's even

26:59

more just like slurring. But

27:02

she has always wanted to launch

27:05

a foundation as part of

27:07

her, I guess, every

27:09

entrepreneur, you know, there's things we

27:11

want to do that achieve that sort of visible success. And

27:13

then there's the thing in our heart that makes us feel

27:16

like we really succeeded according

27:18

to what is most important

27:20

about. The First Supernatural is very much brand

27:22

for me, building an incredible brand, being a

27:25

product, an incredible product. Tory Burch

27:27

has all those things and more, but she had in

27:29

her heart that she really wanted to help

27:32

women, women entrepreneurs, and in

27:34

a way that was not small in a way that was

27:36

huge. Like she has a huge

27:39

vision for helping female entrepreneurs. And I think she's

27:41

just getting started. So I was

27:43

in one of the first classes of

27:45

the Tory Burch Foundation. I think I

27:48

was second class. And at

27:50

that time, there were only 10

27:52

entrepreneurs picked every year. And

27:56

I Guess Very similar to other incubator models, you

27:58

know? we spent a lot of time. The other

28:00

way, he got a lot of incredible

28:02

one on one coaching from people in

28:04

her network and and I think most

28:06

importantly, right that we formed friendship. So.

28:09

Do you play? My.

28:11

Best. Food. They him

28:13

And. Pooja. Started.

28:16

An ally ice cream and then proceed

28:18

with started he dropped or were both

28:21

in my that tory. Burch as we continue

28:23

to be great. Not.

28:25

Awesome! I think all of those

28:27

networks are amazing for that reason.

28:30

So I was reported he Wise

28:32

network the winning a Man and

28:34

I Now I still have so

28:37

many friends from Mack. Group whose

28:39

as well. So speaking about

28:41

your entrepreneurial journey, what's been

28:43

the best part? Probably you

28:45

know, meeting these different. People.

28:48

Creators right that are doing things

28:51

in different industries. But what else?

28:53

What's been so. Great.

28:55

For you and very fulfilling for you.

28:59

I think it. Is. Still

29:01

on. such a surprise to me

29:03

is you know in your twenties

29:05

my first decade I think Princess

29:08

only? very very. Productive and you know

29:10

you work like crazy. Fight off the demons.

29:12

Wasn't emotionally too much about like I found

29:14

and I'm. I the company that I

29:17

think then. And

29:19

still. Since. I'm connected

29:21

to this is an earth sell like

29:23

I personally didn't know where and my

29:25

time building what we were building is

29:27

are so many reasons in your twenties

29:29

I your thoughts on that stuff anyway.

29:33

I didn't know that feeling my on

29:35

start to feel so much of start

29:37

of Laurent Daschle about how. Much

29:40

of a yoyo it is and on

29:42

him and there's There's never a straight

29:44

lines where we're going in a four

29:46

star free time for like three times

29:49

in history. But for me, Is

29:51

that fit? Every problem has been from my.

29:53

Own. Problem to solve. And

29:55

then Ealing deeply zooming in school

29:58

in any. time it's something going wrong,

30:00

I have the power to fix it. Anytime there's

30:02

something that needs to be done better, if

30:05

I'm not doing it, who

30:08

is? And I think in

30:10

other companies, just the frustration of not

30:12

being able, if something's not my specialty,

30:14

and yet I wish it would, of

30:16

course, in my 20 year old universe, wish

30:19

it was done another way, that

30:21

I couldn't, I didn't have any power to change it. And

30:24

I think that's just been such

30:26

a surprising thing about entrepreneurship for

30:28

me, is just how emotionally even

30:30

killed I have

30:33

been inside the entire growing

30:35

journey. Like never would have expected that

30:37

and didn't expect that. Yeah,

30:40

I mean, that's amazing. It's

30:42

surprising because so many entrepreneurs say

30:44

it's like this, you know,

30:47

peak and valley that goes

30:49

on and it's unpredictable and

30:51

it's a little chaotic versus

30:53

they're previous. So that is

30:55

great to hear. So what strategies

30:58

have you deployed to really help

31:01

people get to know

31:03

supernatural? And, you

31:06

know, obviously buying ads

31:08

on Amazon or on

31:11

Facebook seems to be one way

31:14

to do it, but you're a

31:16

small company, bootstrapped,

31:18

for the most part

31:20

to date. How do

31:22

you build a strong and loyal

31:25

community that really knows what

31:27

you're all about and purchases

31:29

your products? That

31:32

is, yeah. So I would

31:34

say, you know, supernatural, our secret weapon,

31:36

which is not something that every CPG

31:38

brand can do because of

31:41

the race and how hard it is to run

31:43

a profitable business on Amazon. But

31:47

I think I brought something over

31:49

again from my tech background, which is just,

31:52

I could invest a ton of money in my

31:54

own DTC presence, Being a storyteller

31:57

there and pulling people into my own

31:59

storytelling environment. And. Class

32:01

or I can take advantage of the faith.

32:03

Is there anything for me to do that?

32:05

where? People are in our. And

32:07

he might have adapt. And

32:10

so. I think our

32:12

secret weapon has to Really fun.

32:15

To. Use Amazon. Everything

32:17

sense of storage. Find component

32:19

that we can use than

32:21

ever. done strategically. and

32:24

then of course also back at with advertising

32:26

for some people there that my know if

32:28

like that there are other were by. I

32:31

know one and grocery store sells. Economy has

32:33

a pussy was think that's right. that's a

32:36

nice. Is. T inches to tonight or

32:38

a. And. On dammit you know

32:40

anything one channel and who knows if the

32:42

merchandise or put your product by stating I

32:44

direct said the goon even know that they

32:46

are in stock and I am at nine.

32:49

I have a number of click that

32:51

are all happening before people even starts

32:53

well where I can see the most

32:56

important thing and I can share exactly

32:58

what it is that where about. Him

33:00

why he should care. No way

33:02

I can do that. Retail shelves

33:04

and. At. Some point people are at

33:06

Joe's you and you don't need to

33:09

in your to. Tearing through the promise

33:11

and excites them. Another place, new product

33:13

and so forth. Fights for supernatural. It's

33:16

after the the. Chimney.

33:18

Beat people that are organically starting

33:20

to search for better option in

33:23

there. So. Much debated.

33:25

Shed No Tears Appearance of small children

33:27

looking for die free. And should be

33:29

able to. Be. To than his

33:31

first three. you know I can tell that story.

33:33

Some of the one of them are converting, a

33:36

lot of them aren't But there's still hearing the

33:38

story of a lamb on that page. Definitely.

33:41

I mean, I feel like when

33:43

you're doing something unique to an

33:46

industry to it you need to,

33:48

and I certainly know this with

33:50

with Ten. Zoc. Counter to express

33:52

away when we started the company

33:54

in two thousand and five it

33:56

was No one was during and

33:58

unsweetened play with water. Unfortunately,

34:00

when you're the only one, they're doing

34:02

it. Ah, or the largest one, they're

34:05

doing it. You have to do all

34:07

the it's east and rabbit and storytelling

34:09

and it's designed. It really is. It

34:11

takes. Much longer than we ever

34:14

saw it was. It's just it's

34:16

just a lot above and beyond.

34:18

Your own company for sure. So

34:20

last question, what's the best advice?

34:23

That. Maybe you've heard are

34:25

you would give to founders were

34:27

seeking a cat. Got this great

34:29

idea. Now. Why? and said

34:31

they do it, shouldn't they do it

34:33

I'm sure you've been asked us a

34:36

million times like. You know people are

34:38

like, wait, how? Did you? How did

34:40

you become fearless and decide to

34:42

just go off and do this?

34:44

I've What advice would you give

34:46

someone? The. So. I

34:49

live event and when I asked that

34:52

question assembly the. For I started. Insula

34:54

and when he said it's very. Obvious

34:57

other than answers here it's like outs

34:59

and then all of something that I

35:01

think it's more of the my twist

35:03

on it sites and I had given

35:05

that like incredible opportunity in interviews that

35:08

so didn't do it like a curse

35:10

the master of every answer into like

35:12

one word and and I am fanatic

35:14

that I sent in in what he

35:16

said with. Start. He

35:20

doesn't start. You know that I've

35:22

said it. You.

35:25

Can just start. And then the

35:27

part that I added has one foot

35:29

in front of the other every day.

35:31

That is actually the entrepreneurial journey. Like

35:34

starting is. Great

35:37

and failing. South a decent his

35:39

brief to like to never. Be.

35:41

Worried if he felt that point. But

35:44

the other part is just. You. Will

35:47

spend years. Year.

35:49

System. One step in front of the

35:51

other. Fifty. Nine and I'm

35:53

gonna leave. Like everyone's like you to

35:55

take a mild jump. Really just the

35:58

grind and their ability to keep. nose

36:00

down and

36:02

just work every day. Just

36:04

work every day. And I

36:06

noticed the same thing, you know, in

36:08

tech startups where why

36:11

are some people winning? Why are some people not

36:14

winning when that product over there was actually better?

36:16

And a lot of times it does,

36:18

of course you want it all, but a lot of times

36:20

it also just comes down to like who works

36:22

the hardest and the smartest. And

36:24

not necessarily even the longest, but just

36:26

keep going. So starting to keep going.

36:30

A great wisdom for sure and

36:32

lessons. So Carmel Hagen, founder and

36:35

CEO of Supernatural, thank you so

36:37

much. We'll have all the info

36:39

in the show notes. Really appreciate

36:42

your time and all of

36:44

your great wisdom that you've given us. I love

36:46

being here. Thank you so much for having me.

36:49

Thank you. Thanks again for

36:51

listening to the Kara Golden show. If

36:53

you would, please give us a review

36:55

and feel free to share this podcast

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37:05

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37:08

Kara Golden. I would love

37:10

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37:12

free to DM me. And if you

37:14

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37:16

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37:19

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37:24

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37:26

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37:28

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Thanks for listening and goodbye

37:35

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