2:00

suggests one of the two named suspects

2:02

in Cherie's disappearance could have known

2:04

this place very well.

2:07

There was also an outside chance this site

2:09

could hold evidence related to the murder of Joyce

2:11

Yost, the subject of Cold Season 2.

2:15

These two cases, Cherie Warren's

2:17

and Joyce Yost's, are likely unrelated,

2:20

but they occurred in close proximity to

2:22

one another, in space and time.

2:26

Over the last nearly 40 years, they've

2:29

bled into one another. We've now

2:31

taken detailed looks at both in this podcast

2:33

and heard repeated references to Causey

2:36

Reservoir. The Causey area is about 20 miles

2:39

east of Ogden. There's a Causey Reservoir. Did

2:42

you ever hunt in the Causey Reservoir

2:45

area? Causey is an area up the

2:47

canyon. He scooped their body up and

2:49

they drove to Causey. He

2:52

had two reservoirs up there that are

2:54

deep, Causey and Woskry. On

2:56

really steep trails going up to the right hand

2:58

side of Causey. That's why Roy City

3:01

Police invited myself and several

3:03

of my colleagues from KSL TV, the

3:05

Salt Lake City based news station I work for, to

3:07

watch as they excavated this site. Breaking

3:10

news happening right now, law enforcement agencies

3:12

in Weber County are digging right now

3:15

what appears to be a burial site

3:17

that might be connected to a four decades

3:19

old murder case. If you're not in Utah

3:21

or don't watch the news here, you

3:24

probably didn't hear anything about this.

3:27

So let me bring you up to speed. In

3:29

this episode, we'll review the evidence that

3:31

points to the possibility of a grave site near

3:33

Causey. We'll go to the site

3:35

of this dig and I'll share where

3:38

the search for Cherie Warren stands now

3:40

that the dust has literally settled.

3:46

This is a bonus episode of Cold Season 3,

3:49

the Causey search. From

3:51

KSL Podcasts, I'm Dave

3:53

Cauley.

4:07

Let's begin with a recap of the Joyce Yost

4:09

and Cherie Warren cases. Both had

4:11

their start in the area of Ogden, Utah back

4:13

in 1985. Joyce's case

4:15

came first. That April, a

4:18

man Joyce had never met followed her home from

4:20

a club late one night. Doug

4:23

Lovell confronted Joyce in the carport outside

4:25

her apartment in the city of South Ogden. People

4:29

sexually assaulted Joyce, kidnapped

4:31

her and held her captive.

4:33

Joyce,

4:35

fearing for her life, promised

4:37

not to tell anyone what Lovell had done if he

4:39

just let her go. He

4:43

did. When Joyce made

4:45

it to safety at home in the early morning

4:47

hours, she called her sister. This

4:50

is Joyce's own voice explaining

4:52

what her sister said. She said, well, you who

4:54

called

4:54

the police? And I said,

4:58

I really don't want to be put through these humiliations.

5:00

She said, in

5:01

fact, the more she heard from me, the

5:04

angrier she was getting. And she said, well,

5:06

you call the police right now. And she said, if

5:08

you don't, I will. So I

5:10

said, I will.

5:13

Joyce soon met with Detective Bill Holthouse.

5:16

She told him her story. Holthouse

5:19

believed Joyce, and he arrested

5:21

Doug Lovell that same morning on suspicion

5:23

of rape. He looked at me with

5:25

an expression that got

5:28

my attention, but it just was

5:31

like it froze the moment. And

5:34

he said, this will not go to trial.

5:37

Through a series of mistakes and mishaps,

5:40

Lovell found himself out of jail while

5:42

awaiting trial that summer. He

5:44

tried to hire two hitmen, but both

5:46

fell through. So in August, 10

5:49

days before the scheduled start of the trial,

5:52

Doug Lovell crept into Joyce Yost's apartment

5:55

through a window, startled her awake,

5:58

and slashed her with a knife. Lovell

6:01

then took Joyce away in her own car and

6:03

hit her body. Weeks

6:07

later, at the start of October, Cherie

6:10

Warren walked out of her work at the headquarters

6:12

office for the Utah State Employees Credit

6:15

Union in Salt Lake City. She

6:17

told a co-worker she was going to meet her estranged

6:19

husband at a nearby car dealership. Afterward,

6:22

Cherie planned to take her young son to

6:24

her parents' house in the city of Roy. She

6:27

never made it. Right now,

6:29

police say they're investigating the disappearance but have

6:31

very little to go on. What we're

6:33

asking for is just to locate where she may

6:35

be or any evidence to show that

6:38

it or indicate that there is maybe

6:40

some foul playing ball so that we can

6:42

do a different type of investigation

6:44

rather than missing persons. Roy City

6:47

Police at first focused on Cherie's estranged

6:49

husband, Charles Warren, thinking he

6:51

might have killed Cherie over their ongoing

6:53

divorce. Charles told

6:55

Roy Police Detective Jack Bell he had canceled

6:58

his planned meeting with Cherie at the dealership

7:01

on the evening of her disappearance and

7:03

instead went jogging. A weak

7:05

alibi Detective Bell was never

7:07

able to corroborate. I wish

7:09

she hadn't looked so guilty

7:12

to start with, but he

7:14

did. Charles Warren wasn't

7:16

the only suspect, though. Police

7:19

also came to wonder if a former Ogden City Police

7:21

Reserve officer named Carrie Hartman

7:24

might have had something to do with Cherie

7:26

Warren's disappearance. Carrie

7:28

and Cherie had been dating. Six

7:32

weeks into the investigation, Cherie's

7:35

car unexpectedly surfaced behind

7:37

a casino in Las Vegas, Nevada.

7:40

That opened up a whole new can of

7:42

worms. How did it get there?

7:45

Which one of these two birds that

7:47

I'm looking at have the opportunity

7:50

to get it down there? Because

7:52

Roy Police were trying to answer that question,

7:55

Doug Lovell revisited Joyce Yost's

7:57

body somewhere in the mountains, burying

11:56

police

12:00

to Joyce Yost's grave. In

12:02

the summer of 1993, he led police to a mountainside

12:06

east of Ogden. It held no

12:08

signs of human remains. It

12:11

was also nowhere near Causey.

12:14

Former South Ogden detective Terry Carpenter

12:16

told me he believes Lovell lied about

12:18

where he buried Joyce Yost. She

12:21

is someplace else and honestly

12:23

to this day I believe she re-warrants with

12:26

her. Otherwise, if we

12:28

go up and dig and find

12:31

Joyce and find Cherie,

12:34

that negates all the agreements that we've

12:36

had with him of not executing him. And

12:38

he knows that. So he's not going to take

12:41

us to Joyce. I've looked for evidence

12:43

that might link Doug Lovell to Cherie Warren

12:45

and I've not found any. Lovell

12:48

himself denied having ever met Cherie Warren

12:50

when this speculation first surfaced 30

12:53

years ago. But there are those

12:55

who hold to this theory even today.

12:57

In 2004, Weber County

13:00

investigators flew over the mountain behind

13:03

Causey in a state helicopter. They

13:04

were operating on the assumption Carrie Hartman

13:07

had killed Cherie Warren and left her

13:09

body somewhere near Causey. This would

13:11

have been the road that I think he had access to.

13:13

There's unlimited places where he could have dumped

13:16

her along here. Hard to think like

13:18

a bandit, you know, would you have picked

13:20

a characteristic turn or rock

13:23

or tree or something to the landmark?

13:26

A year and a half later, a detective named

13:28

Shane Miner questioned Carrie Hartman about

13:30

Cherie Warren's disappearance. Miner

13:33

asked Hartman directly if he had killed

13:35

Cherie and taken her body to Causey. Did

13:38

you kill Cherie? No. Hartman

13:41

said he didn't have any idea what had happened

13:43

to Cherie. You know, she's placed in

13:45

an area where her cause is dead. It's

13:48

not a good idea. A

13:50

year after this, in 2006, a prison

13:53

informant started talking to police about

13:55

Joyce Yost. He said Doug

13:58

Lovell had drawn him a map of the place. where

14:00

he had left Yost's body. This is

14:03

the lake.

14:04

There's some gates up here, it's a property.

14:08

The informant claimed Lovell had taken

14:10

Joyce Yost to Causey Reservoir.

14:13

You see these circles here? He's

14:15

telling me this is Huntsville. And

14:17

this is Causey. Your

14:20

head's probably spinning by this point. It's

14:23

so much to keep track of, I know. Not

14:26

all of these leads are credible. Sorting

14:28

fact from fiction remains a major

14:31

challenge in these two cases. But

14:33

what I hope you're seeing is a lot of circumstantial

14:36

evidence points toward Causey Reservoir as

14:38

an important landmark in the disappearances

14:41

of Shuri Warren and Joyce Yost.

14:47

My job involves taking scattered fragments

14:49

of a story, spreading them out and

14:52

putting them in order. Sometimes

14:55

the individual pieces don't look like

14:57

much on their own. It's only when they're

14:59

assembled that a picture emerges.

15:02

If done well, the story that comes

15:04

out of this process should draw as

15:06

close to truth as I can possibly

15:09

get it. Perfect

15:11

truth is nearly impossible to

15:13

find. Often holes remain.

15:16

Unanswered questions like, where is

15:18

the body the anonymous caller reported finding

15:21

near Causey? And why couldn't anyone

15:23

find it? I've struggled

15:25

to come up with a satisfactory answer. I've

15:28

studied a century's worth of old maps, seeing

15:31

the gradual development of trails and roads

15:33

in the mountains around Causey. I've

15:35

read newspaper archives about the generations

15:38

of sheep-herding families who owned those hills.

15:41

I've hunted down aerial photographs of Causey, from

15:44

the 1930s, 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, to the 1990s, even

15:49

paying to have old films scanned at ultra-high

15:52

resolution. I've

15:54

gone up into the air myself, by plane

15:56

and helicopter, to study the thousands

15:58

of acres of inaccessible private land.

15:59

it land behind Causey.

16:15

Through all this, I became very

16:17

interested in a stretch of old Jeep road.

16:20

In the 1980s, this trail linked

16:22

Causey Estates, where Kerry Hartman

16:25

was known to spend time, to the

16:27

spot on the mountain top, where a witness

16:29

said he saw Hartman four days after

16:31

Sherry Warren disappeared. Much

16:34

of the Jeep trail falls within the radius

16:37

that Anonymous caller referenced when he

16:39

described finding a woman's body.

16:49

As my focus narrowed onto this old

16:51

trail, I came across something unusual

16:54

in the aerial images and video I had collected.

16:57

The trail climbs

16:59

a hill heading east out of Causey Estates.

17:02

At the top of that hill, I saw a

17:04

pile of rocks, about six

17:06

feet long and three feet wide,

17:10

roughly the size and shape one might

17:12

expect for a clandestine grave.

17:15

It wasn't clear from the images I'd collected

17:17

if the rock pile existed before the 1980s. Those

17:20

older pictures just weren't clear enough to

17:22

tell. But I was able to determine the

17:25

rock pile had sat undisturbed since

17:27

at least the early 90s.

17:32

As we come up on the anomalous rock pile, I

17:36

was able to visit the rock pile myself. You

17:38

should see how it stands out from the surrounding

17:43

environment. I carried

17:45

a camera with me to document the site

17:47

and the old Jeep trail nearby. As

17:50

you look around, you can see there are rocks on this trail,

17:52

but there are no other piles

17:55

of rocks of similar shape

17:58

and size. So that is unique.

18:01

This discovery presented a bit of a

18:03

conundrum. The code of ethics

18:05

that guides my work as a journalist says I need

18:08

to act with independence. I

18:10

don't work for the police, and I don't

18:12

automatically share everything I know with

18:15

them. But if this rock pile did

18:17

mark a possible grave, it felt irresponsible

18:20

to simply ignore it or to publish

18:22

that speculation without taking steps

18:24

to find out for sure. I

18:27

shared images of the rock pile with a handful

18:29

of trusted colleagues and sources who

18:31

all agreed my eyes were not mistaken.

18:35

It did look like it could be a grave.

18:37

Again, unnatural. Unnatural

18:41

rock pile. So

18:45

I provided this information to Roy City

18:47

police detective John Frawley, the lead

18:49

detective on the Sherry Warren case. He

18:52

thanked me for it. Some

18:54

time passed. Then

18:57

in August of 2023,

18:59

I received word Roy police had

19:02

news to share. Good evening, breaking

19:04

news out of Weber County where police plan to conduct

19:06

a major search related to a

19:08

Utah cold case dating back to the 1980s.

19:11

It's a

19:11

case we've covered extensively right here at KSL

19:14

as part of the cold podcast.

19:16

We plan to be on the mountain with police

19:18

as they explore this site tomorrow. Stay with KSL

19:21

TV throughout the day for any breaking

19:23

developments. I had an exclusive

19:26

invite to come along as police went

19:28

to cause me to dig below the rock pile

19:30

looking for possible human remains.

19:43

Don't make yourself the subject of your own

19:46

story. This mantra

19:48

is foundational for journalists. It's drilled

19:52

into our heads by professors and editors.

19:55

But college didn't prepare me for a career

19:57

in which journalism would take me on the hunt.

20:00

for human remains. Finding

20:02

this odd rock pile while

20:05

looking for a clandestine grave around Kazi

20:08

made me a subject in my own story.

20:11

My managers at KSL recognized

20:14

this, and they decided

20:16

to assign a different reporter to cover

20:18

the story of the dig. I

20:20

would still be there to watch and provide

20:22

comment and context, but reporter

20:25

Dan Rascone would put the story on the air.

20:27

New specialist

20:27

Dan Rascone giving us exclusive

20:30

access to this site and the operation.

20:32

So Dan, tell us where you are, what you've been

20:34

seeing there. This is a

20:35

big operation. Yeah, this is a major

20:38

operation undergoing right now. This

20:40

wasn't the only ethical consideration.

20:42

KSL also took a few steps to safeguard

20:45

our independence. We decided

20:47

we would provide our own transportation to

20:49

and from the site, which meant finding someone

20:51

with four-wheelers available on short notice.

20:54

We told police if we came along,

20:57

we'd have the freedom to share anything we

20:59

saw or heard with you. They

21:02

agreed.

21:06

We met in the morning as low

21:08

clouds settled in the mountain valleys, catching

21:11

sidelong rays of the rising summer sun.

21:15

Our caravan of SUVs headed east from

21:17

the small town of Huntsville, driving

21:19

up Utah State Highway 39, following

21:21

the south fork of the Ogden River to Causey.

21:25

One by one, we drove across the

21:27

dam to the gate for Causey Estates, drawing

21:30

curious stairs from fishermen and paddle

21:32

boarders. Another mile or

21:34

two on dirt and gravel brought us to the bottom

21:37

of a steep hill. We parked, goused

21:39

ourselves in sunscreen and loaded

21:42

equipment onto ATVs, cameras,

21:44

coolers, pop-up shades and shovels. There

21:48

weren't enough seats for everyone. Some

21:50

of us donned backpacks and hiked the remaining

21:52

mile to the rock pile, grunting up

21:54

steep switchbacks. We

21:57

reconvened up top on a saddle

21:59

overlooking the river. in cozy estates. The

22:02

CSI team set up a laser scanner,

22:05

a $40,000 piece of equipment designed to make a 3D model

22:08

of the site. It sat on a tripod,

22:11

rotating and beeping as we all waited. They

22:19

launched a small drone to collect more imagery

22:21

from above. If

22:24

evidence of a murder came out of the ground, this

22:26

would be crucial to show what the site looked

22:28

like prior to its excavation. Another

22:31

member of the team used a small handheld saw

22:33

to cut back overgrown brush and branches

22:36

around the rock pile.

22:41

With the ground clear, the CSI

22:43

team set down their tarp and raised an awning

22:45

over the rocks.

22:47

As they did so, my KSL colleague

22:49

Dan Rascone went to work conducting interviews.

22:52

He asked Roy Police Detective John Frawley

22:55

what would happen next. What are you going

22:57

to, I mean it seems like a very methodical

22:59

process. It's not like you just bring out the shovels

23:02

and start digging. No we want to be very

23:04

respectful. Also there's

23:06

a proper way to do

23:07

this and so the

23:09

Weber County CSI team is

23:12

very professional and they're

23:14

going to handle this.

23:15

I think what John was getting at here was

23:18

if the search about to get underway turned up

23:20

human remains, we all needed

23:22

to remember what that might mean.

23:25

My mind turned to all the people I've

23:27

met over the last several years who would

23:29

be watching live coverage of this search

23:31

on TV. We know there are families

23:34

of victims, missing women,

23:36

Cherie Warren, Joyce Yost, another person

23:39

who could potentially be up in this area and

23:42

they have for the last four decades

23:44

wondered where are their loved

23:46

ones and they're today watching

23:49

and waiting to see what comes out of that so that's really

23:51

difficult. So we

23:53

could find a body today.

23:56

We won't know until Weber County

23:58

CSI starts doing their work.

23:59

but I don't think you get this

24:02

team up here unless they think it's

24:04

a reasonable possibility that they might recover

24:06

human remains here. At the same time,

24:08

none of us wanted to presume an outcome that

24:11

hadn't yet happened. And if you find anything?

24:14

If we find anything, we will slow

24:16

down at that point and figure

24:19

out what we have and what needs to happen

24:21

then. We would obviously follow

24:24

where the evidence leads us. We

24:27

wouldn't want to make any pre-determinations. If

24:30

we did find something, we want to keep

24:32

an open mind and see

24:33

where the evidence would lead us at that point.

24:36

A low roar began to rise

24:38

from the south. It

24:40

grew louder, drawing

24:43

near until a helicopter crested above the

24:45

mountain and began to orbit overhead. There

24:48

are probably

24:48

these Arnold's Works and other stuff.

24:51

I don't know what this is.

24:52

This was a chopper. It

24:55

belonged to KSL, Chopper 5,

24:57

the very helicopter that had helped find

25:00

this odd rock pile in the first place. Over

25:03

the sound of the thrumming helicopter blades,

25:05

the investigators began removing rocks from

25:07

the pile and tossing them to the side.

25:12

Stone by stone, they worked

25:14

to expose the bare ground beneath. They

25:17

sent spiders scurrying and even disturbed

25:19

a hornet's nest. There's a pile

25:22

that we looked like we found

25:22

something. Who doesn't know of this rock? Yeah,

25:25

everybody runs from the... What's

25:27

going on? What's going on?

25:31

Game on. Game

25:33

on!

25:36

With the rocks removed, we could see the pile

25:38

had covered a divot or depression.

25:41

The ground under the pile sat 8 to 10

25:43

inches lower than the surrounding soil. This,

25:46

I had learned, could be a clue because

25:48

when a buried body decomposes, the

25:50

ground above it may settle.

25:53

I felt a sense of guarded optimism

25:55

as the investigators began removing soil.

26:00

They passed the loose earth off to be sifted.

26:05

The idea here is dirt will fall through, while

26:08

larger items like teeth, bone chips,

26:10

or cloth fragments will be caught by the screen.

26:13

It's not as easy as it might sound, because

26:16

each bucket load of soil held hundreds

26:18

of small pebbles too large to fall through.

26:21

The CSI team had to visually inspect

26:23

them.

26:29

The closest analogy I can think of for this

26:31

is it's like looking for a single tiny

26:34

piece of Lego in a giant heap

26:36

of bricks that are all a similar

26:38

size and color.

26:40

While this work was unfolding, the

26:42

KSL team went live on the air to

26:45

share it with the public in real time.

26:47

Yeah, we're high on a ridge right now just outside

26:49

of Causey Reservoir. Is

26:52

possibly a burial site

26:54

for Cherie Warren? She disappeared

26:56

back in October of 1985. We're

26:59

going to go ahead and bring in Dave Colley here,

27:01

of course, with a cold podcast. And Dave,

27:04

tell us the significance of what is happening

27:06

here right now. We're seeing the detectives

27:08

are using shovels and picks

27:10

to pull soil off of this

27:12

site to see if there is anything

27:15

of evidence related to Cherie's

27:17

case coming out of that. They've taken

27:19

just a few inches off the top and

27:22

it will be a really slow process over the next

27:24

several hours. I wasn't surprised when no skeletal

27:26

remains surfaced beneath the first few

27:28

inches of dirt. It stood to reason

27:31

if anything or anyone was

27:33

buried here, it

27:34

wouldn't be right at the surface. You

27:37

just decided with Dave when you think you guys are

27:40

at your limit. Not my call, so you guys

27:43

make it. Let's go.

27:46

Let's go. Let's dig it. We've

27:48

got enough to dig right now. Can we dig it? Yeah,

27:50

I

27:50

mean you've got stuff to do. Load after load of soil went through

27:52

the screen. Only

27:55

once or twice did the searchers pause, like

27:58

when an old 22 caliber shovel was in

27:59

casing, maybe a century old, caught

28:02

up in the mesh. Hour

28:16

after hour passed. Scattered

28:18

clouds crept across the sky, casting

28:21

shadows that sat on the landscape like spots

28:23

on a dalmatian. The hole

28:26

sank progressively deeper.

28:41

The excited, nervous chatter

28:43

that had pervaded earlier in the day faded away.

28:47

A specter of disappointment loomed. By

28:49

mid-afternoon, the hole reached a depth of between two

28:51

and three feet.

29:07

The detectives who were taking turns with the shovels

29:09

noticed a change. So that color

29:12

of dirt has been consistent

29:14

all the way across, or at

29:16

least three or four inches of dirt. They

29:20

reached a layer of soil that had not been disturbed

29:22

before. Proof

29:35

no one had previously dug a hole that

29:37

deep at the site. It

29:43

might have looked like one, but Detective

29:45

Frawley said the rock pile didn't

29:48

mark a grave.

29:59

gone. You know, if there's a place to dig, we're going

30:02

to dig. If there's a place to search, we're going to search,

30:05

and we're just not going to stop. So we

30:07

will follow every tip and every lead.

30:11

Look, I'm not going to lie. This

30:13

outcome left me feeling deflated.

30:16

In the time between my discovery of the rock pile

30:18

and its excavation, I told myself

30:21

not to build up any expectations.

30:24

It was far more likely someone's dog

30:26

was under those rocks than a murder victim.

30:29

And even if human remains were buried there,

30:32

they could have belonged to a sheep herder, a

30:34

pioneer, a fur trapper, or

30:36

an indigenous person. I knew

30:39

this.

30:40

Still, I couldn't ignore the

30:42

possibility, no matter

30:44

how low the probability.

30:47

Maybe this would be a break.

30:50

I'm human. So yeah, I

30:52

allowed a little hope. But there

30:54

was nothing. No bones

30:57

of any kind. Sweeping

30:59

my eyes across that mountain, as the

31:02

police packed up their gear and raked

31:04

loose dirt back into the hole, seeing

31:06

the brush and trees spanning

31:09

to the horizon, I felt a sting

31:11

of futility. If Cherie

31:13

Warren or Joyce Yost are up here, can

31:16

we ever really hope to find them?

31:20

Maybe not. This

31:23

is the real nature of cold casework. It's

31:25

perpetual disappointment. And

31:28

yet I refuse to accept a fatalistic

31:30

view. This search mattered

31:32

for many reasons. It took one

31:35

more location off the list of possibilities.

31:38

It prompted new discussion about what

31:40

happened to Joyce Yost and Cherie

31:42

Warren, and it sent a message

31:44

to their killers. We

31:46

will not stop. Detective

31:49

Frawley said it well. If there

31:51

is a place to search, they are going to

31:54

search. If there is a place to

31:56

dig, they are going to dig. And

31:59

is that what you do too?

31:59

cold podcast? Yeah, absolutely.

32:02

So for the cold podcast, you know, our

32:04

job is to tell these stories, to

32:07

tell Shuri Warren's story, to let the public

32:09

know about what's happened in the past and what's happening

32:12

right now. But that doesn't mean that this

32:14

case ends when our podcast

32:16

ends or that we stop paying attention. So

32:19

I myself, KSL, the cold podcast,

32:21

we're dedicated to continuing to follow Shuri's

32:23

case. And if we come across

32:25

any new information, we will be

32:28

out on the next mountain doing

32:29

the next search.

32:34

In every setback, I see progress.

32:38

In every hole excavated, we

32:40

plant a seed of new opportunity.

32:43

A fruitless search is not defeat.

32:46

It's a step on the path toward

32:48

truth.

32:51

This will not be the last

32:53

search. If

33:08

you have information about the disappearance of Shuri

33:10

Warren, now is the time to share it. You

33:13

can reach me by emailing cold at ksl.com

33:15

or contact the Roy

33:17

city police department at 801-774-1063. I also want

33:20

you to know, if you've experienced abuse

33:26

or sexual violence, you're not alone.

33:29

There are trained experts ready to listen

33:31

and help. In the United States, survivors

33:34

of rape and sexual assault can connect

33:36

to free resources through the Rape Abuse

33:38

and Incest National Network at rainn.org.

33:43

If you or someone you know is experiencing domestic

33:46

abuse in any form, you can

33:48

reach the National Domestic Violence Hotline

33:50

at thehotline.org. Cold

33:54

is a production of KSL podcasts and

33:56

Wondery in association with Workhouse

33:58

Media. Cold is researched,

34:00

written, and hosted by me, Dave Cauley.

34:03

Audio production and sound design by Ben Kebrick

34:06

and Aaron Mason. Mixing and

34:08

mastering by Ben Kebrick. Michael

34:10

Bonmiller composed our main theme, with

34:13

additional music this season by Allison

34:15

Layton Brown. For Amazon Music

34:17

and Wondery, Managing Producer Candice

34:20

Manriquez-Wren, Producer Claire

34:22

Chambers, Senior Producer Lizzie Bassett,

34:25

and Executive Producer Morgan Jones.

34:28

Special thanks to Kale Bittner and Allison

34:30

Vermeulen. With Workhouse

34:32

Media Executive Producers Paul Anderson

34:34

and Nick Piniella. And

34:37

for KSL Podcasts, Executive

34:39

Producer Cheryl Worsley. For

34:41

pictures and more, go to our website, thecoldpodcast.com,

34:46

and follow us on social at The Cold Podcast.

34:49

Most of all, thank you for listening.

35:00

Every big moment

35:03

starts with a big dream. But

35:05

what happens when that big dream turns

35:08

out to be a big

35:10

fluff? From Wondery and

35:13

At Will Media, I'm Misha Brown, and

35:15

this is The Big Fluff. Every

35:17

week, comedians join me to chronicle

35:19

the biggest flubs, fails, and blunders

35:22

of all time, like Quibbing. It's

35:24

kind of like when you give yourself your own nickname and you

35:26

try to like get other people to do it.